Why do some oldschoolers feel fallout 3 was bad?

Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:34 am

Dont get me wrong, fallout 1 and 2 are awsome. (i played fallout 3 first then played them) but it seems that some oldschool fallout fans would have rather had the vanburen game. This seems absolutely insane to me.

So here are a list of things i feel that greatly added to fallout because of fallout 3.

The game greatly reinforced the 1950s era feel to the game, something that was hard to get a feel of in the first games. (especialy in mr.handy)

Players got more intune with the brand names. Nuka Cola plays a huge part. Robco, Corvega, red rocket, hubris comics, vault tech of course.

You get a better feel of the ghouls lifestyle and what they are.

The huge ammount of misc story found from exploring buildings.
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Joanne
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 7:45 am

For me, the downer of Fallout 3 was that it lacked some of the spirit of the first two games. While I might not have the patience to replay Fallout of Fallout 2 today, I can say I played the games many times before they became boring. I've only played through Fallout 3 once, and frankly, I feel no urge to ever play it through again. Same flaw as Oblivion. You can do it all in one play through...eliminating a reason to play again and again to see what other options you could pursue.

The first games gave you several paths to the same end. It was fun to try different character designs. Perks were more meaningful. High or low SPECIAL stats made a significant different to how your game play experience went. Bethesda (IMHO) evened out too many peaks and valleys. Making it so you could not kill children (even by accident...which is how it happened to me the first time in the prior games), just sanitized the game in ways that took something away from it. A ton of F-bombs used in the game, but not as much witty dialogue as I feel the preceding games had.

Admittedly, the look of the game overall was a huge leap forward with my only real detraction being the limited size of the vaults (something we really wanted to see expansion on).
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marie breen
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 3:25 pm

Making it so you could not kill children (even by accident...which is how it happened to me the first time in the prior games), just sanitized the game in ways that took something away from it.

Child killing is now a restricted topic on the forums due to past problems. I certainly don't see a need to remove your comment zer0netgain but this should be the last time it comes up in this thread.
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Jade Barnes-Mackey
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 8:11 am

For me, the downer of Fallout 3 was that it lacked some of the spirit of the first two games. While I might not have the patience to replay Fallout of Fallout 2 today, I can say I played the games many times before they became boring. I've only played through Fallout 3 once, and frankly, I feel no urge to ever play it through again. Same flaw as Oblivion. You can do it all in one play through...eliminating a reason to play again and again to see what other options you could pursue.

The first games gave you several paths to the same end. It was fun to try different character designs. Perks were more meaningful. High or low SPECIAL stats made a significant different to how your game play experience went. Bethesda (IMHO) evened out too many peaks and valleys. Making it so you could not kill children (even by accident...which is how it happened to me the first time in the prior games), just sanitized the game in ways that took something away from it. A ton of F-bombs used in the game, but not as much witty dialogue as I feel the preceding games had.

Admittedly, the look of the game overall was a huge leap forward with my only real detraction being the limited size of the vaults (something we really wanted to see expansion on).


Well for one ide agree with not killing children because stupid people will try to ban the game for it.

Really? only played it once? dude ive played it like 6 times. atleast go 1 evil 1 good. First time i was stealthy saint. second time i was a power fist weilding chuck norris.

the game has sooo many different paths. like ten penny tower for example. you could kill all the ghouls. you could kill all the humans. or you could somehow convince them to live in harmony.

there isnt really that much more to vaults eh.. its just more and more corridors. i was actualy annoyed getting lost in some of them.

Either way, as a fan who started with fallout 3, its still an epic game. And vegas is going to bring back alot of the stuff that was missing.

but let me ask you, would you rather have new vegas as isometric? or the oblivion engine?
the same gos for fallout 1. would you rather play it 3d than iso? i know i would. i love being able to pick up objects. mess around in ways you cant in iso.
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Travis
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:25 am

oh wait and oblivion having no replay value? man... i must have played every single class in that game. (mind you i didnt explore every single location everytime)
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Bird
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 5:23 am

i played the first two and tactics after FO3, as iv never been big on pc games. i did like 1 & 2, i thort tactics was awsum. but for me, bringing the whole FO universe down to first person point of view was wicked. and the game play didnt seem to have changed to much, just no point and click, but i think it was a good move to reinvent the game, and still keep the atmispher and feel of the game relitively the same. i dont see why people make a fuss over the change, just look at grand theft auto, that changed dramaticly between gta 2 & 3 but i dont remember any complaints (not including the ones to get it banned lol) any way back to FO. yer i love all four games, and i always thort we ''young'ens'' couldnt respect things of that past, not so. i think its all the fuddie duddies (lol) not acceping change, things change people.

The futures bright, the futures fallout!!!
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Sarah Kim
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 8:45 am

Dont get me wrong, fallout 1 and 2 are awsome. (i played fallout 3 first then played them) but it seems that some oldschool fallout fans would have rather had the vanburen game. This seems absolutely insane to me.

So here are a list of things i feel that greatly added to fallout because of fallout 3.

The game greatly reinforced the 1950s era feel to the game, something that was hard to get a feel of in the first games. (especialy in mr.handy)

Players got more intune with the brand names. Nuka Cola plays a huge part. Robco, Corvega, red rocket, hubris comics, vault tech of course.

You get a better feel of the ghouls lifestyle and what they are.

The huge ammount of misc story found from exploring buildings.



I feel some FO1 and 2 fans have misplaced loyalty in those games and have a feeling they're betraying them if they admit to enjoying FO3. That combined with some nostalgia leads to a panning of an updated game that most people consider brilliant. If they released FO1 and 2 using the same FO3 engine some of them still wouldn't be happy even though it would be the same game updated.
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Rudi Carter
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:50 am

I feel some FO1 and 2 fans have misplaced loyalty in those games and have a feeling they're betraying them if they admit to enjoying FO3. That combined with some nostalgia leads to a panning of an updated game that most people consider brilliant. If they released FO1 and 2 using the same FO3 engine some of them still wouldn't be happy even though it would be the same game updated.


id understand if they remade 1 & 2 as it can spoil a classic if its not done right (praise god for monky island 1 & 2). playing previous games always brings back fond memories, and if that game were to be remade or updated, i can see how it would upset some people.
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Josh Lozier
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:15 pm

I'm an oldschooler, and I love Fallout 3. I first played Fallout 2 back in 2002, then went back to 1, then Tactics. I played Oblivion near when it came out, and loved it. Then heard that Bethesda was making Fallout 3. I thought it was excellent news. I have a real soft spot for Fallout 2, but that's probably because it was the first one I played. All these games have their faults. I could sit for hours and criticize every last one of them. But I'd rather play them and have fun. Is the glass half full, or half empty? The only Fallout I get venomous with is Fallout:POS. Yeah, I spelled it that way on purpose. That game reeks.

There are some places on the internet that will label you a troll just for liking Fallout 3, and having the stones to say so. You just can't please some people. I'm guessing they're glasses are half empty. But they do seem to know alot about Fallout 3. They must have played quite a bit of it. I don't know. If I really don't like a game, I don't keep playing it.

re: gooch: Tactics is definitely under-rated. It's different than the others, and some of the lore is off, but I have a blast playing it. But I've always liked strategy games.
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Andy durkan
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:40 am



re: gooch: Tactics is definitely under-rated. It's different than the others, and some of the lore is off, but I have a blast playing it. But I've always liked strategy games.


its weird, like they completely said skrew the 1950s stuff. even went from bottlecaps to ring pulls.

Its good, it just has some control issues with ctb.

i really wouldnt mind if they remade 1 and 2 with the tactics engine but kept the 50s look
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Sandeep Khatkar
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 2:05 pm

Fallout 1+2 with all the Tactics combat options would have rocked!

About Van Buren: Imagine this. New Vegas is coming out soon. Then tomorrow, the news comes out that it's been cancelled, and Bethesda and Obsidian are going out of business (some extremely illegal corporate conspiracy comes to light or something, I don't know). No New Vegas or Fallout 4 for you. Years pass, and the news comes out that Bioware has bought the rights for Fallout, and is going to publish a new one using the Dragon Age 6 engine. They're calling it Fallout: The Re-Awakening. They say they're big fans of Fallout 3. You've been waiting years. You just know it won't look anything like New Vegas. No Mr. House, no anti-Materiel Rifle, No Caesar's Legion, or NCR, no Dinky the Dinosaur. All gone. That's Van Buren.
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Micah Judaeah
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 7:08 pm

Fallout 1+2 with all the Tactics combat options would have rocked!

About Van Buren: Imagine this. New Vegas is coming out soon. Then tomorrow, the news comes out that it's been cancelled, and Bethesda and Obsidian are going out of business (some extremely illegal corporate conspiracy comes to light or something, I don't know). No New Vegas or Fallout 4 for you. Years pass, and the news comes out that Bioware has bought the rights for Fallout, and is going to publish a new one using the Dragon Age 6 engine. They're calling it Fallout: The Re-Awakening. They say they're big fans of Fallout 3. You've been waiting years. You just know it won't look anything like New Vegas. No Mr. House, no anti-Materiel Rifle, No Caesar's Legion, or NCR, no Dinky the Dinosaur. All gone. That's Van Buren.


i suppose that makes sence. I just did some searches for "fallout 3 svcks" and there are some stupid.. stupid people... i mean crap. they are downing oblivion like it was bad. that game was awsome too. also did a search for "fallout new vegas svcks" and same crap. people are downing it. people are downing obsidian.. hellloooo its black isles ppl!
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BRIANNA
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 8:46 am

I'm guilty of being one of the ones who only played Fallout 3 and never bothered with the first two games. Personally I think much of the hatred for Fallout 3 is silly. I can understand when fans of an old game series get mad when it gets handed to a new company or changed drastically like the Resident Evil series did, but even if Fallout 3 wasn't a Fallout game 110% true to the older games it was still a great game in it's own way. It brought the open-endedness of a Post-Apocolyptic World from the first games into a 3D environment with the ability to explore settlements and ruins in decent next-gen 3D Graphics. And it's not just the graphics, it's the realism of the world. Objects move when knocked around, blood appears on enemies, every NPC has its own voice, etc. Fallout 3 is just a really fun game and doesn't deserve to be labeled as a bad game just because the style is different from the first two. When you think about the changes done to a game's plot or gameplay that usually happens when the game is sold to a new company, just remember that it could always be a lot worse.
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noa zarfati
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:39 am

Wow. I'm surprised this thread wasn't an immediate FB gripefest.

I played Wasteland, FO, FO2 and Tactics all the years they were released so I definitely qualify as what it has said in my sig since I joined this forum. I chose the term Old School to indicate my history with the game but separate myself from the hard core (anti FO3) FO fans.

I loved all the titles mentioned, but I have wanted to play FO in the first person since I played FO the first time. I agree with most of what each post so far has said. Tactics brought combat to the level it always needed to be. Too bad they abandoned the majority of what made FO great. I stated in a post a couple years ago that "FO 3 does the whole Fallout theme BETTER than the originals". Boy did that provoke screams of heretic. Those games just couldn't bring the in your face depth of the theme like a true 3D world could. Showing an occasional picture of something like the water chip could only hint at what FO had to offer.

Now for the down side. IMO Gamebryo is ill equipped to bring the level of reality to FO that I want. The art is fine, though animations could use a little work, but I want more reality in the combat (see comments on Tactics above). I DO NOT WANT a pure shooter but if I am going to spend so much of my time shooting guns at things, I want some realistic ballistics. I think Stalker did a great job of implementing just enough realism in the shooting. I want a more realistic cover system. Even just leaning would be a major improvement, but an actual cover system would be even better. This would overlap with better stealth characteristics. Not to mention being able to go prone.

ALL of this could be achieved without reducing the wonderful theme, npc interaction, quest lines and side quests, the little touches in details, etc. one iota. I am sick of all the people screaming COD when discussing realistic combat. For all those people that are freaked out by this I have 2 words for you (no, not those 2 words), "Auto Aim".

Bullet sponges. Come on. If an elf can drop an oliphant with 3 arrows to the brain, Surely emptying a 30 round clip into a supermutants ear should be enough to drop him, no matter what caliber of weapon I'm using. This directly relates to.....

Leveling. It's way over rated. And when you add level scaling, becomes totally pointless. What do you need more HP for if the world gets more HP at the same time? I don't mean do away with skills, traits and perks. These are the things that define a character, not HP. Skills should increase from actually using them. A few points allotted at "level up", but maybe 50% through use.

I'd like to touch on animations. If I hit some creature with a flamer, killing me should be the LAST thing on his mind. Set ANY person on fire and all the care about is getting away from the flames. Bring back the Funky Gerbil. The dazzling dance of death that makes the flamer worth using. In FO / FO2 if you torched someone they could quite often run all the way across the screen, screaming and flailing before they finally dropped. Thats the way it should be.

Well, I think thats it. If Beth implemented everything I mentioned, I guarantee they would have the greatest game ever created. And none of the changes I suggested would take ANYTHING away from what makes Fallout great. Fallout 3 is a good game because of the things that make the franchise great. Not the mechanics.

Wow. That got a little bigger than I thought it would.
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Mashystar
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 2:46 pm

What I dislike about FO3 is (I'm not saying it's completely bad, FO3 has its moments):

- Clipping issues.
- Certain aspects of the story.
- Karma: no reputation & consequences.
- Towns: not enough, far-fetched and too small.
- All skills 100%: no traits i.o.w. no specialized character.
- Dialogs: "I'm President Eden" -> "Please blow up!" -> "Okay, right away"
- Difficulty: lack of multiple ways to solve problems by critical thinking. See skills/character.
- Re-playability: I played FO3 maybe 4 or 5 times and I'm sorry to say: I simply got bored eventually.
- Quests: oh, go this way, talk to this NPC and open this box, lalalala... here's two-thousand exp. and a magical stat altering shiny thingy.
- No maturity which I can't understand; it's okay to show as much gore as possible. But bring out the pitchforks & torches when a boob is slightly visible or even mentioned.
- etc, etc, etc, ...

And I can't wrap my head around the whole house and make it look pretty concept. Wasteland wanderers don't need a [censored] house it's not like the bloody Sims FGS!

Don't get me wrong there are things that I did like: Tranquility Lane, the secret Vault Tec vault, Galaxy News Radio, Moira's wasteland quest and certain combat scenes.
Whatever... I already elaborated enough about this subject in previous posts. Furthermore it also comes down to the player's preferences and tastes.

FO1&2 had their issues too, no game is perfect.

But did anybody ever mentioned the endings? In FO3 there are basicly 3 endings: good, neutral and evil which is a bit mediocre imho. While in FO2 there is a lot more in-depth info about what happened to all the places depending on your actions. I don't remember how it was in FO1 anymore, it's been a while since I've played it.
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Beulah Bell
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:24 pm

... So here are a list of things i feel that greatly added to fallout because of fallout 3.

The game greatly reinforced the 1950s era feel to the game, something that was hard to get a feel of in the first games. ...

Why is that I wonder? It really does make you think; The 1950's era feel was difficult to "get a feel of in the first games". Its almost like the architects of the series got it wrong...
At least it seems so until you consider that the game was set in an idealized 50's future paradise that met with a harsh dose of 'real world' desperation and unexpected demise.

Fallout has no greasers and beehive helmet haired wives, or bubblegum chewing clicks of school girls in poodle skirts ~Fallout is set in 2161. For 80 years folks either lived cushy in the vaults or suffered hell on the surface. Everything 50's-esque in Fallout came from before the war (and most of its broken). Its the architecture (the little of it still standing), and the rusting heaps of old vehicles There is very little anything resembling 1950 in the world that the Vault Dweller emerges into (even if though that may have been what he expected ~or not... Its never really pressed or made definite as far as I ever saw). The closest thing to 1950 anything that I can recall in Fallout is Decker himself and Butch ~and that's it. :shrug: (maybe Gizmo but its a stretch). Its a brave new world where the mutations resemble the 50's SCI-Fi monsters; and radiation really makes green ghouls ~The Fallout world's physical laws are in sync with the pre-war hysterical beliefs about radiation and atomic bombs. While there is no denying the retro-futurism of the series; there is nothing in FO1 that implies that the present day world there is "stuck in the 50's" (it just has common aesthetics ~and always will... even when designing computerized fusion powered robotic infantry armor for a nuclear ground war). Take the above as my opinion only; having played the game.

There is a long standing pattern in this series. First Fallout 1 set the stage; then Fallout 2 expanded it, and IMO (have to say that), started straying from the design with things like the chess playing scorpion, and mobster suit wearing gangsters toting tommy guns in the year 2241. Tactics left the whole RPG part behind entirely, and FoBOS.... well... yeah.
Come Fallout 3, we find a hodgepodge mix of rehashed aspects from Fallout 1 & 2, with a heavy bent on a 1950's mania in present day people... Like the Tunnel Snakes (all dressed up like http://www.shanana.com/). IMO its gross misinterpretation of the material. Sometimes right, sometimes not ~sometimes waaay off the mark.

Players got more intune with the brand names. Nuka Cola plays a huge part. Robco, Corvega, red rocket, hubris comics, vault tech of course.
But it didn't play a huge part in the games before. Nuka~Cola was an awesome joke because it was addictive. (Same kind of joke is done again in FO2's film studio, where you hire on for a job in New Reno and immediately get poisoned.)

You get a better feel of the ghouls lifestyle and what they are.
How?
*Not to mention that supposedly all ~ALL~ ghouls come from Vault 12; though its at least plausible that east coast ghouls could result from similar circumstance. I don't see the purpose for getting a better feel for the Ghoul's lifestyle since the PC can't ever become one (and Moira and any others that did ~shouldn't have). I did like the Ten Penny Ghoul ending until I realized that it changes nothing, and Ghoul merchants pop out of the ether to begin selling there. :eek:
Towns in FO were acceptable; towns in FO3 were http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/incredible.

The huge ammount of misc story found from exploring buildings.
200 years later, you can find mini-nukes in old barns and unlooted first-aid kits that have advanced military drugs designed for the battlefiled. I'm not disputing what you are saying, but none of it made any sense IMO. (Which is part of the mistake... Fallout was not about wacky absurdities ~unless you were in the deepest wasteland, and its an in-joke for the player ~not to be taken completely literal... It is and it isn't).
One of the things that actually impressed me about Fallout was that most of the drawers and lockers were actually empty unless you were someplace that no one had been for looong time, or were in someone's building that they used frequently.


**Edit:
(especialy in mr.handy)
This I don't quite get... What do you mean exactly?

For me the current Mr. Handy doesn't look awful; (as in doesn't look an awful lot like he did 30 years prior in the game).
The one thing that surprised me the most in FO3 was that Mr. Handy looked like http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/NewHandy.jpg and not http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/Mr-Handy31.jpg.

(and http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/comparison.jpg...)
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Melanie
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:15 am

oh wait and oblivion having no replay value? man... i must have played every single class in that game. (mind you i didnt explore every single location everytime)

i agree, oblivion had lots of replay value and FO3 does even thought the skill and perk overabundance kinda broke that aspect of the game, fallout 3 did have a lot of faults, its still a great game but i am looking forward to improvemtns in the future fallout games including NV, a better skill and perk system, traits, weapons mod, more quests, i never played fallout 1 or 2, i'm sure they were fun, but FO3 still has attracted way more people to the franchise than the earlier games and bethesda revitalized gthe franchise in a big way. but there are lots of things in FO3 that need improvement in future games, i would of like more enterable structures and buildings than in FO3, the vast majority of buildings, stores, houses, apartments, you just couldn't go in, i would of liked less metro tunnels maybe and more smaller structures we could enter, and fallout 3 had too much stuff blocked, the area near gratditch and falls church was way too blocked off, and near rivet city it was just too blocked off.
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Cathrine Jack
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 3:33 am

But did anybody ever mentioned the endings? In FO3 there are basicly 3 endings: good, neutral and evil which is a bit mediocre imho. While in FO2 there is a lot more in-depth info about what happened to all the places depending on your actions. I don't remember how it was FO1 anymore, it's been a while since I've played it.


FO was the same way. I suppose they didn't want to bother having to narrate stuff for everything you could do in the game, but FO3's ending was utterly lame and two-dimensional. Having Three Dog comment on your escapades was just annoying.

The first two games had something to say on every town you touched. Even some endings (Necropolis) were time-related. If you didn't finish the game within so many game days of first entering Necropolis, the good outcome would not happen for the inhabitants.
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Lou
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:42 am

FO was the same way. I suppose they didn't want to bother having to narrate stuff for everything you could do in the game, but FO3's ending was utterly lame and two-dimensional. Having Three Dog comment on your escapades was just annoying.

The first two games had something to say on every town you touched. Even some endings (Necropolis) were time-related. If you didn't finish the game within so many game days of first entering Necropolis, the good outcome would not happen for the inhabitants.

I thought so.

Personally, I'm not a big fan of time-related stuff, I usually get nervous. Although I can see why some gamers appreciate it, in real life some things have urgent deadlines too. :)
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Samantha Jane Adams
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:18 am

ok when fallout 3 came out i loved it still do everything about it i love the gore, vats, the feel of the game when just exploring, and how every location has its own feel and story, but yes the game was not perfect it did have problems but still a great game, i have played through about 4 times got about 300 hours logged ,there is just so much to see in the game its insane, then i played fallout 1 and 2 it took me a while to get into because im so used to good graghics and the turn base thing is not my cup of tea but i did like them i really did there good games but i still like fallout 3 better because its the first one i had played, i think its stupid when people say its a bad game there just retards
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IsAiah AkA figgy
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 9:00 am

Basically, they [censored]ed about everything that will be added in New Vegas.
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Allison Sizemore
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 3:46 pm

Indeed, why do oldschoolers feel Fallout 3 is bad. I am an oldschooler, and yet love 3 for having so much more content and variety of play, with generally speaking similar mature content as 1 and 2. Unless with the passing of time, my memories of how it was with 1 and 2 have faded to an extent that, I now see nothing wrong with FO3, but on the contrary, see 3 as being a great improvement. Gone are the mind-numbing step-by-step disengagements of combat, for instance, that could seem to go on forever in turn based combat. The Perks are pretty much in line with FO1 and FO2 as I seem to remember, only some being really worthwhile, the same as it is in FO3. But perhaps this oldschooler is not focussing enough on the dissimilarities of some small details between the old Fallouts and Fallout 3, I don't know. Maybe some see any such dissimilarities as being game-breakers, and that would seem to put the game appreciation fault with "not me but them" .. chuckle.
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Amelia Pritchard
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:37 pm

Actually I'm replaying FO3 now, I don't want to say it's a bad game but IMO these are it's shortcomings

1) No traits to help define your character. The traits allowed you to customize your character in a way that would have an actual effect in the game.

2) The overall story and the lacking ending even with broken steel has been covered so many times.

3) Uninspired quests, nothing made me even sweat, or even stop and think "hmm how do I want my character to handle this", it was mostly straight forward

4) Too much redemption and nicey nicey. This is PA its meant to be gritty and grimy and sure I can accept their would be some altruistic people, but on the whole in PA the settlements look out for themselves, I liked three dog, I thought a PA radio station was nice idea, but all this "fight the good fight" was cringe inducing, I get it the devs want a clear line between good and evil, but in PA that does not work so well. Report the goings on in the wastes, and pretty much all the rest but leave the "good fight" to lawful stupid characters in fantasy games

5) Either set it on the west coast and use whats established there, or set it on the east coast and come up with some new stuff. The game felt a bit like "heres everything from the first two games, see it really is a fallout game" instead I would have liked to see new factions (even a powered armoured based faction that did "protect the innocent people of the waste (wait, what?)" instead of mauling the BoS), by transporting all the elements of the west coast onto the east, fudgey reasons abound and some just out right ignore what happened in the first two games. In FO2 the BoS played a tiny role, blink and you miss it, and super mutants where hardly seen, FO is more than the established factions.

6) Some of the settlements where silly, building a whole town around a live nuke? A settlement of children right outside a mutant base? Very poor design. Paradise falls was good, and the big raider camp was well done.

7) Emil and Todd where still starry eyed about having had their first child, Emil explains this is why we are searching for our father and the whole starry eyed children are our future lets make the world a better place, that all first time parents get seeps through the game. A 17 year old protagonist that can grow a thicker beard than some 35 year olds? Give em a few years a one or two more kids and they will lose this and we won't have dialog options like "I miss my dad so very much" I didn't like the sentimentality that comes with the MQ

8) Dialog options where a step in the right direction but didn't open up anything new

9) As Pete said writing was not a battle they wanted to fight and in an RPG it shows

These are some of the main let downs for me
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Lisa Robb
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:50 pm

You can't please everyone.
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Adam Kriner
 
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Post » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:45 pm

I'm an "old schooler" (played FO2 when it first came out, then went back to play FO1), but like Rivendell, I think FO3 is great. As to why some "old schoolers" dislike it, I'll start with why I like it.

When I first learned Bethesda was doing it I was concerned, especially as I'm not a fan of FPS games, but they did a great job at capturing the feel of Fallout, having a good story, and having a large, interesting, gameworld. Not to mention including references (and more...) to FO1 & 2 and Tactics. It also sold well enough (!) that I have hope for more games that, while appealing to the FPS demographic, are designed well-enough to still appeal to those like myself.

So the story is very good, and the gameplay, I thought the way VATS is implemented is fantastic. As noted I'm not a fan of FPS (I also can get motion sick playing a computer game!), for me VATS captures the spirit of the combat and action points of the older Fallout games, while being innovative and allowing for a larger audience of FPS fans to play. The best of both worlds.

Praise aside, to answer the original question: many people, if something isn't perfect and exactly what they want, complain. Look at reviews and comments about great movies, books, games, whatever. Bethesda makes the GECK editor freely available and people complain it's not user-friendly enough. Companies have patches delayed a week for QA and people go off on rants about how they're betraying their customers and should be boycotted. When the game ended permanently, people complained. When Broken Steel allowed one to play after the "end" of the game, different people now complained. FO3 - if played "good" - arguably has a less-depressing ending than FO2. I like that, some people wouldn't. It's first/near-first person, not my favourite but still a great game, some people wouldn't be able to get past that objection (just as some people whine about VATS ruining the purity of a FPS...).

Seriously, if Bethesda, tomorrow, announced that they were introducing a FREE expansion that linked up characters and events from FO3 and New Vegas, there'd be a bunch of posts whining about it being too late, should have been introduced sooner, why are they using an outdated graphics engine, expansions ruin the finality of games, etc.

Now, does the story for the never-completed Van Buren sound interesting? Would I have been happy if it had been completed? Probably yes to both. But on the other hand, it could have been a piece of crap like BOS (by reputation, I never bothered playing it). I don't allow thoughts of what "might have been" a great game, to ruin my enjoyment of what is a great game, FO3.
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Lawrence Armijo
 
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