When official patch support tends to be limited to the year or so following release, the "patch easy glitches first" argument is not very encouraging as it brings to mind an office full of people scrambling to find spelling mistakes, ignoring the fact the sky's falling in on them because kill enough time on the smalk stuff that takes zero effort and eventually the bell will ring, official support will cease and it won't matter how many glaring problems exist by that point.


Not something you'd want people to think if you're a company known for leaving games in incredibly buggy states that rely on player created unofficial patches to get working properly.

I've done:

- Not playing at all but kept the patches and will resume my playing once Automatron is released and with a new character that will build settlements with zero population only.

I am starting to:

- Spend some time in the board bringing up some issues as I see them happening.

But I have the game with all the patches up to date afraid of encountering the bugs I had before. Between patch 1.3 and patch 1.4 I had to play offline because of the game freezes when pressing the Options button in PS4. To be fair, that has been fixed with the new patch.

You could simply downgrade to v1.0.9 (the unpatched game) just long enough to duplicate several thousand of each material or whatever you need, then repatch straight back to 1.4 when you're happy with what you have. Right now you can bob back and forth between patch versions pretty easily.


Mods will come eventually, so if Bethesda make patch 1.5 save in a way that makes those files unreadable in v1.0.9 I suspect many will just remain on v1.0.9 with the most recent file that does work until mod support arrives, but there's no reason to remain unpatched longer than you need to at the moment so the problem bugs in the unpatched game shouldn't be a big deal or even trigger especially if you're only Dogmeat or shipment duping.

I am already done with that character anyway, but thanks. I ended feeling, literally, burned out after finishing the main via the Minutemen. Automatron seems to be a very decent excuse to re-start the game from scratch and hopefully I won't need an excessive amount of materials because I might just build 3 small settlements to keep my shiny robots and companions. But you are absolutely right, easier to delete patches than spend hours trying to buy enough shipments. Thanks!

It's as easy as changing a value in a dropdown box, cause that's all it is. One for lock difficulty and another for a key.

Look at Bobbi No Nose's terminal for something else anyone with the CK could fix in seconds. Set it's scale to 1 or whatever the other terminals are and boom it's readable.

PC players have access to tools that console players don't. It's a fundamental difference between the platforms. That doesn't mean that Bethesda should leave a bug in the game to help console players get closer to the PC experience. You bought a console knowing full well that it wouldn't have the flexibility of a PC. That's just how it is.

Exactly. It's not like those bugs actually get taken off the disc or anything.


If Bethesda want to spend time and money on code that never gets run, because the people it's meant to affect are sitting on lower revisions while everyone else simply isn't even trying to exploit in the first place, it's fine.


It reminds me of those settlers who tighten non existent valves.

What "bug" are we talking about? Because there are plenty and I assume they "came in the package" so they are not a player's fault. What "experience"? Inputting some commands? Heck, that's the Company's job: to fix issues. Not my responsibility when I purchased a game that was supposed to be playable in a Console. You guys in PC want to fix'em? Fine. Let the Company fix XBox1 and PS4 problems, because we can't, but we still expect a "customer service" response.

I'm honestly not even sure what you're trying to say here. I'm referring to bugs like Dogmeat item duplication and shipment duplication. Many console players feel that these bugs should be left in the game because it puts console players on a more equal footing with PC players. I think this is dumb, and agree that bugs need to be fixed. Some console players need just understand and accept the limitations of their platform.

Or remove the patch. We can do that too.


We can go back to v1.0.9, dupe half a million copper, statue glitch all the way up to level 300, then continue playing with that same character in patch 1.4. We can basically ignore the fixes entirely meaning they have no reason to exist.

I don't expect to see mods for ps4 anytime soon sony is kinda paranoid. they feel the need to approve or disprove all content released on the system

Who says it's a bug? Honestly, I am actually pretty dumb when it comes to understanding how to click buttons in the right order to duplicate items (that "Kick in The Head "was a serious one, I guess) but I've noticed a lot of players got that "MECHANIC" right. So.... good for them. A bug is something considered as an element not intended by the game designers. So why did they leave it there on the first place? Sorry, but the company's quality control department must be fired if that's the case.

Now, let me be simplistic and quote what the wiki has to say about game mechanics: Game mechanics are constructs of rules or methods designed for interaction with the game state, thus providing gameplay. All games use mechanics; however, theories and styles differ as to their ultimate importance to the game.

Let me add: " In videogames, gamers have a well-defined notion of what is considered gameplay. This is:

• What the player can do


• What other entities can do, in response to player’s actions^"

There's your homework: What PLAYERS CAN DO. Think about it. I am honestly too tired and want to plan my next Institute playthrough while watching a movie in Netflix . Can we talk about it later once we all process such semantic discrepancies? For me, is a matter of mechanics and I understand if other players want to differ.

The Dogmeat item duplication glitch and the shipment duplication glitch are not game mechanics. They are bugs. They are not intended to be there. If you're not used to Bethesda games having bugs, then you must be new here.

Pretty much any game is going to have patches to fix bugs. Some of these bugs will be game breaking. Some bugs will be seen as beneficial by many. But they're all bugs. If your argument is that these aren't bugs, then you don't really have much of an argument...because they unquestionably are bugs.

There are absolutely no semantic discrepancies here.

Unfortunately you just explained why it's a UNFAIR ADVANTAGE. IF OUR QUEST BREAKS, WE ARE STUCK WITH IT.


Bethesda has already done the great by making a Game that accepts mods for consoles. In my opinion, we console players deserve the same [censored] that PC players get. You always say it's just a tool, but you guys also show that a vast majority don't use it as a tool.


Think about that.

No those are Glitches. Let me tell you the difference:


Glitch- 99.99% of the time caused by the player, and doesn't break the game or a quest. A lot of times beneficial to the player.


Bug- Game breaking, can make quests stop working and characters no longer work.

New in the Board? Sure! I just joined it a few hours ago. New to Bethesda's games? No. Not at all, trust me. I even have a personal blog dedicated to Skyrim if that matters. I am a little too familiar with these games. That's why I say that patches addressed to fix "bugs" are just a joke if they are not actually bugs. If they were actually bugs, a lot of employees would have pink slips on their desk by now. Nah.... They are just fooling us pretending they fix minutia such as this to keep Generation Y players happy They have to justify their pay check by calling it a "bug". Who cares about Doggy's magical duplication skills? Give me a glitch free game and we're good.

I'll tell you a story: when I first played the game I had a "problem" during the quest where you kill the Deathclaw in Concord. Somehow, the game did not recognized a named raider being killed if Preston or the Deathclaw got him first. So many players were stuck not being able to move forward in the Main Quest. PC players resurrected Gristle (that's the name of the raider) kill him and then move on. In XBox1 and PS4 we couldn't do that and some of us had to re-load a save in order to continue. After the first patch, such "BUG' was fixed.

Here's the facts: https://www.reddit.com/r/fo4/comments/3s4zoo/bugs_megathread/cwublly

Please note that it is under a "Bug Mega Thread". Now, that's what I call a "real bug". Duplication? A simple game mechanic. As a console player, I do need the developers to take care of "real bugs" and expect the publishers to be less sensitive about semantic issues and PR image. The game might not be perfect, but a lot of customers like me still put money and time and it. That should be enough to make them understand that we need their help to make this game more enjoyable..

You know, arguing the point around and around in circles isn't going to suddenly cause Bethesda to reevaluate those supposed fixes, and we're not going to formally get those features back before mod support arrives. All we're getting is this huge row going on between console and PC sides and that's just pointless.


Console owners - you have a solution. Reinstall the game without applying any patches, then glitch all you like before patching back up again. It works. It's easy. And heck, if an exploit required us to jump through harder hoops we'd do it without question so let's just accept this.


PC owners - I'm glad you don't mind the fact that console exploits may have held up worthwhile updates for your version of the game, just don't go too ballistic while we casually ignore all those fixes and get what we want regardless.


And Bethesda - remove backwards compatibility at your peril. Nobody just has the one save, so all you'll achieve if you do that is force console owners to retreat back to v1.0.9 and just sit it out until mods arrive. Sure that takes us completely out of the market for the DLC that's about to arrive, but many of us consider the exploits just too valuable to give up.

lmao

for you maybe, not for everyone. just becaue you have a bunch of autists making skyrim / fallout look like anime doesn't mean everyone does it.

How can you want stuff equal to the PC on a console? PCs are more expensive for a reason, they do more stuff and have less limitations. Like I said earlier, it's like buying a cheap phone and then demanding it does all the things the latest iPhone does, cause it's "unfair".

The game mechanic is the fact you can buy shipments, the glitch was the fact you could duplicate them. Glitches are not game mechanics.

I never said it did - but if one or two videos of people playing normally on PC popped up somewhere in the first 100 or so "Fallout 4" YouTube search results, and we saw less "nvde mod" type thumbnails, glitch showcases and crazy assisted megabuilds we wouldn't have such a problem believing otherwise.


You PC folks advertise yourselves a certain way, why's it our problem when we believe what we see?

First off, let me clear about one thing: I play FO4 on the PS4, not PC. Second, as others have indicated, the Console Commands exist as a tool to either help modders with building mods, or debug glitched quests. Not all PC players use the console commands to cheat. As far as I know, there is no such thing as an Unfair Advantage in a Single Player game. If this were a MP game, that would be a different story.

We console players do not deserve the same stuff that PC players get. We're very fortunate that we're even getting mods at all.

Also, consider this: How would you open the console on a PS4? On the PC, it's opened using the ~ key.

What happened to the days where people bought their systems understanding what they were getting? I grew up on consoles and accepted I was at the console manufacturer's and game developer's whims as to what was available to me. I' dknown for a long time the PC gamers could do amazing things; fixing your own games? Almost unlimited content? Yeah, I was jealous.

You know what I did about it? I built a PC. I understood the pros and cons of different gaming platforms and decided that I wanted in on all that PC gaming freedom. Consoles will never be equivalent to a gaming PC. That's not me saying "herpa durr PCMasterRace" or even "consoles are teh suxxorz". Neither statements are true. It's simply a fact that they are designed for different things with different capabilities.

But I'll accept the line is blurring with mods coming to consoles soon, but even with that it will not match up to the PC experience simply because we have decades of experience and infrastructure to support it. The sooner the people complaining about Bethesda fixing bugs understand the reality of the situation the better.

As to the argument that Bethesda should fix other stuff first. Well that's just ignorant. They'll fix what they want, and of course they'll start with easy ones; ones that won't cause a chain reaction of other things going wrong. How many times have they been slated for fixing one thing and breaking two? How much flak have the Unofficial Patch Teams that do it for free taken when they've not actually broken anything and it's the users fault? The simple fact is these are things in Bethesda's game that aren't the way they'd like it to be, so they fixed it. If you have an issue with development tools being in the PC version of the game then you can kiss your console mods goodbye.

There's plenty of shipments in the game for all the builds I do, the trick is to remember to stock up when not building so you dont spend ages shopping around mid build.