Curious but which weapon were you using?

One of those machine guns. I never paid attention to which one, but I believe it is the Chinzor. It doesn't have a wind up or anything like that. It just starts firing.... I did put some attachments on it, cant remember which.

The Maximus has a 75-round mag and can equip a front attachment, mag attachment or top attachment. The Chinzor has a 100-round mag, can't ADS and can equip a front attachment or mag attachment... I gotta be honest, neither are very good at all beyond CQC. They both have pretty hefty recoil, especially the Maximus, and terrible spread. Even burst-firing is ineffective. Still fun to use though.

That was kind of the point of asking the question as both of those weapons are terrible compared to their high capacity mag, front grip, sight of choice AR counterparts. The Hammer, AGL and Gotlung are perhaps the only Heavy weapons that fulfill a role better than the non-Heavy options.

EDIT: The fact that the player claiming that the Heavy is quite good yet cannot recall which weapon or attachments they were using only demonstrates their limited experience, especially since both LMGs are quite distinct.

For the record, I have four level 20 characters and two of them were taken to 20 as Heavies (one as a soldier and the other as a medic). Currently only one of them is still a Heavy (the soldier) and even that is being reconsidered.

I do find that the Chinzor handles spread a little better than an AR, it just recoils quickly and has to be burst-fired beyond point blank range. But ARs have burst-firing to maintain some degree of precision at mid-range... the Maximus can be burst-fired, but it's spread is probably worse than a Rhett from what I remember. I do play Heavy best when using SMGs/ARs, but that's because those are the weapons I'm used to.

Though I will say, I hate the Gotlung. Piss-poor damage output unless you're close enough to give the enemy a hug thanks to the spread, and the wind-up time... I'd rather use a Chinzor. I also think the Mossington > the Hjammerdiem, and the AGL can be utterly devastating in the right place at the right time, but it's very situational.

I guess this shows that it really does come down to opinion and personal experience, some people can do well with it and some can't. Personally I don't get why people touch themselves over the Carb-9, I can't get the spread to work for me at all beyond strictly CQC. I also really don't play all that well as a Light, I'm definitely my best as a Medium. And I gotta say, a Heavy is one of the scariest things you can run into in a corridor, they've mown me down plenty of times. Lack of mobility means nothing when you only have a couple meters to move sideways, or backwards to retreat.

I agree about the Mossington being better but the Hammer does fulfill a unique role. In a similar manner the Lobster has a much larger blast radius than the AGL but the AGL fulfills a specific role that the Lobster cannot. That is all I meant about those those Heavy weapons being able to fulfill a unique role.

Oh, the CARB-9 stinks at medium-long range but that is why the pistols are downright brutal. I use a Sea Eagle with a COGA scope and I dare say it kills faster than most ARs. The Ritchie is pretty nasty too.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy playing my Heavy but the weapons are greatly lacking as I often resort to using Medium weapons on my Heavy in place of the inferior Heavy versions, with very few exceptions. The only reason my soldier is still a Heavy is because I use a Mossington and Gerund w/ launcher or a Euston and Gerund w/ launcher. Against bots, however, I will gladly substitute in a Heavy weapon like the AGL, Chinzor or Maximus.

ahhhh ..yeah... HUH???
My understanding of the game is to complete the objectives and work together as a team, thus the heavy fullfilling his roll as a HEAVY and setting up in a choke point and cutting the enemy down.
Oh and......... i have watched other people try to do the same thing in a match and be unsuccessful so saying that it takes little skill is ignorant.

IMO the people complaining about this game are just DOING IT WRONG

humm ... if there was a route to flank enemies with heavy weight ... what would be the point to be a medium/light ???
Heavy medic sux, i agree ... but soldier/engineer heavy is great !

Yeah, I get what you mean. I think the Heavy could be considered JUST as viable as the Light bodytype, even by doing something as simple as reducing the spread of all Heavy weapons (except AGL/Hjammerdiem), even by a small fraction like 10-20%.

The Carb-9 stinks at close-range sometimes, too. I do the same thing if I'm Light; the Sea Eagle is essentially a 1-handed and more accurate (not kidding) Rokstedi, the same with the Ritchie except it's a less-accurate Drognav.

Though I will say, the one time I've seen the AGL used very effectively was actually Versus on Reactor. Some Heavy went to outside that entrance into the cooling system, where Security has an MG nest, and he just let rip all over my spawn wave. We kept getting knocked down and pummelled at the top of the stairs, he killed the entire wave of about 5 of us and we lost the cooling system to Resistance.

I love using heavy. Sure i lose different paths and areas to go to, but it fits my style of play, Heavy soldier is what I do best.

I agree about reducing the spread on Heavy weapons. Their ability to sustain fire makes them great for suppression but sadly they lack any accuracy so they are more of an annoyance than a true threat in most cases.

To be honest I used to advocate for the Bulpdaun due to its better than average accuracy at medium range. After playing a lot more though I find that the hip fire stability of the Kross and CARB-9 to be the superior options, especially as you can equip both of those with an SMG Drum Mag attachment. There is honestly very little reward for using ADS in Brink other than sniping or using a COGA scope on a high accuracy weapon. Perhaps headshot multipliers should only work when you are aiming down your sight?

The other fun place to use the AGL is at the start of the second portion of Aquarium as the Resistance. Watching the Security continue to try and push their escort down that tiny hallway while continually to knock them down is hilarious. To make matter worse you can stand behind the counter and refill using the Command Post without every having to walk around to the front of it.

I have been playing Brink since Day 1. I don't know what constitutes limited experience, but I have run against bots, full teams of 5 in competition and 8 in Versus and Freeplay and have found my heavy to be effective. Just because I don't focus on the names of the weapons does not mean I don't know how to use what I have. Even in real life, after going to the shooting range multiple times, I still don't know the name of the gun I use. I just don't bother remembering things like that.
@Glyph


Also In general, I did not talk about using the machine gun for distance. I was speaking in reference to mowing those down right in front of me. I did not argue that it was good at a distance and I would NOT have argued that. I am aware of the accuracy issues over a distance, but when you get a group in the hall.... Lights and Medium beware.

What's "distance" in this game? Are we talking Container city from the defender platform by the hackable side door to the sttacking spawn (popular sniper spot), or the Security tower wall to the attacking spawn? Or are we talking something less or more? Neither the Chin nor the Max are the superior weapon at those ranges, but you can still use either from there and do a good bit of damage, and of course that and beyond are sort of the appeal of being able to carry an AR or LR (depending on your skills) as a secondary.

That's quite surprising as when I play competitive we test routes, builds and even weapons. Knowledge is power, right? I just find it surprising that with only two LMGs in the game you cannot remember either. That being said the situational effectiveness of those LMGs is quite limited. I'm glad you had a good experience using them on your Heavy but I fail to see how that proves the Heavy is useful considering that you even admit that the effective range is quite limited. I'm not trying to argue that the Heavy is completely worthless, only that they are situationally worthless in the majority of cases. Sure you may find a situation where the Heavy is dominant but do those situations occur often enough to warrant using a Heavy? In my experience the answer is no and that is why I feel they need a boost in the form of improved weapon accuracy or such.

I've never seen the EZ-Nade knock anyone down, I don't think it can. It does LESS damage than the Lobster, has LESS of a splash radius, and I generally only use it for giggles.

I'll have to test this to make sure. When we were doing this we had two Heavies using AGLs, and the rest of the team was spamming whatever they wanted. The enemy team kept getting knocked down so I assumed it was from the AGLs. I'll post the results once I have a definite confirmation either way.

Isn't this game about situations? I mean, when i run the package or repair, it is about creating a different set up or situation where I last a little bit longer than my teammates and buffs are that much more effective. When i go operative, I approach it from a perspective that is purely for my design of build. When I role a light, I play completely different. My argument was not that Heavies couldn't be shown a little more love, but that they are not USELESS. They have a use and they are darn good at it if used right.

So I think we (glyph and I) they are not useless, but the capacity of their use.

Situations I Use Heavy:

• Planting Charges: The difference of Seconds Matter
  
• Choke Points and Tight Hallways: Just open up with the LMG (light machine gun?), the inaccuracy isn't that big in close quarter
  
• Planting a Turret or mine: A little more breathing room in terms of health
  
• Operative Work: People tend to tentatively shoot teammates every blue moon to spy check, even in this game... Heavies can handle a little spy check and even return fire in time
  
• The Big Man Slide: when I slide through an area first, they focus on me and everyone behind me gets a few extra seconds. (e.g. Container city, I always slide under the middle after tossing a flashbang or molotov or simple grenade when playing soldier... Minus if a turret is there, which I have not encountered on the Resistance side of the wall too often. Time will tell if that changes)
  
• The Big Man Race: while everyone else might get downed by those first few shots, I keep running and if I slide enough and hit corners, my health starts to regenerate, while others are DEAD DEAD DEAD, I am running the Big Man Race
  
• Hacking, getting just that little bit of extra before I unload on that lone light trying to impede my progress.

For me, this is enough reason.

I disagree; I find that I can DOMINATE. Especially with the gun that looks like an M249 SAW. That and the Baldapaun (I think that's what it's called). But, this is only good on certain maps.

All I want is for the heavy to be FEARED. Like in tf2.

I do love me the Bulpdaun, 2nd favorite SMG without a doubt. I'd probably place the Kross and the Galactic in the same league, rather than the Carb... The Galactic is only marginally weaker and a little less accurate, but has great stability and the best capacity of all SMGs. I often find myself swapping between the two as my close/mid-range SMGs. I still ADS though, and prefer to be able to fight at mid-range, so I don't dare bother with SMG drum mags because the spread difference is certainly noticeable.

But I take back what I said about the Maximus, AKA the gun "that looks like a SAW", it's seemingly more accurate and stable than the Rhett, but suffers worse spread increase. I used it just now around the opening in that counter you mentioned for using the EZ-Nade defending Aquarium, and it was doing an insane job of crowd-control. Firing 5-15-bullet-volleys, I was letting the recoil drag me through the group of Security, picking up a headshot here and kill there... if I didn't finish somebody off, then fire from friendlies did. Admittedly, it wasn't so effective at that range with less enemies to hit, like if one or two guys walked in... but I remedied that by just getting closer.

The Maximus is a [censored] beast and one of my new favourite weapons. Lays waste to crowds at close/mid-range, and dominates in face-offs in CQC.



Hell... I know if I come across a Heavy down a dark, lonely corridor, regardless of SP or MP, I'm certainly not thinking "OH GOODIE WHAT A GREAT PLACE TO BE".

Is the extra 1-2 bullets that the Heavy can sustain all they have to offer though? If so, they definitely need to be upgraded in some manner.

What's funny is that by getting to the same objective faster you would have more time to complete it. Likewise for deploying turrets, mines, etc. So the Heavy's slight survivability boost is technically offset by their reduced movement rate in many ways.

A good indicator of value is setting up a competitive tournament and seeing which builds are needed to complete each role. In most games that I have seen the Heavy is simply not used. Being able to get back into the action quickly or moving to support your team is more important than a couple of extra bullets. This could be different if the Heavy's weapons were more dominant but as the game exists now their role is often too limited to warrant using, especially for a tournament setting. That alone tells me that the Heavy needs to be improved. Yes, I understand that Brink is still relatively new but unless major balance changes are made the Heavy will remain a novelty and nothing more, at least in the competitive scene.

People are missing some important things...

The FACT that Heavy weapons are comparable to the other guns in the game isn't being disputed - that's provable and fine. The FACT that Heavies have only a small increase to their health is also without dispute, and again, provable. The "fact" that Heavies are useless/inferior/whatever else is PROVABLY WRONG.

If some players are consistently able to win fights as a Heavy, but aren't able to do so using the same tactics as a Medium or Light, then HEAVIES CATER TO THEIR PLAYSTYLE. This alone makes Heavies NOT USELESS. Just because they don't work like TF Heavies (and aren't trying to), doesn't mean a skilled Heavy isn't a force to be reckoned with.

Effective controlled burst fire with a Maximus can be more effective than AR/SMG fire at mid-range. I personally have used a Chinzor in a relatively full lobby of human players - It's an absolutely brutal weapon up-close, and it's got a better effective range than shotguns, with enough ammo to rip through an entire team before reloading if you're in the right situation. And with burst fire, it can't fire at quite the same effective range as the Maximus, but it's still got a longer effective range burst-firing if you need to use it that way.

Effective use of a Heavy with two Medium Weapons (the ONLY body type which can carry two) can also be BRUTAL - the guy claiming "but range changes" obviously didn't read my post he replied to... AR is EQUAL with SMG at mid-range, and BETTER at long range - no, they don't STAY at long range, but you take the advantage WHILE they're at long range, and KEEP it at mid-range. If they come closer, you're about ready to reload anyway, SWAP TO YOUR SHOTGUN. Suddenly that "rush to close range for an advantage" plan doesn't seem like such a good idea.

For those of you saying "but hardly anyone uses them competitively" - I've answered that in another thread too - that just proves that most competitive players aren't good at using Heavies at this point. Most likely because the majority of preconceived notions from other games are inapplicable to Brink's take on the Heavy. DO IT RIGHT, and it works.

So, to summarise: Heavies fill a particular role in the game BETTER than any class. If you don't try to fill that role, DON'T PLAY HEAVY. Leave that to someone who's good at being a Heavy.

Ditto what Oblivion Said

Show me a player that can use a Heavy effectively in a competitive setting and your comment will hold merit. So far I have yet to see any proof supporting such a claim. So either all of those players svck with a Heavy or the Heavy is simply not worth using. I guess we will have to wait and see how long it is before there is a dominant Heavy presence because there certainly is not currently. Argue all you want but 'the proof is in the putting.'

Myself - Heavy medic, Maximus,
Teammate, - Heavy solider, Gotlung

Escorting on aquarium we were unstoppable, we literally did not stop the escort once. Yes the others were crucial but we stood next to the prisoner the entire time and never had to stop.