Hello everyone,

I have a question regarding the Resource Wars that lead up to the Great War of 2077.

So, I was reading the article that the Fallout Wiki has on the Resource Wars (http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Resource_wars), which says that these wars started because the world's supply of oil and other fossil fuels was starting to dry up. But, if nuclear power has become widely available in the Fallout universe (as evidenced by the existence of fusion-powered cars like the Corvega and of fusion-powered weapons like the laser and plasma rifles), then why is there such a mad rush for oil? Fusion power could provide almost unlimited clean energy; the primary fuel that is required is hydrogen (or, rather, various isotopes of hydrogen), which is the most abundant element in the entire universe (it's in water!).

It seems to me that there is an inconsistency here in that the Resource Wars are described as being massive, continent-wide conflicts over oil, but they occur in a world that should no longer need to rely exclusively on fossil fuels. At least, the world of Fallout should only be minimally dependent on oil. Maybe poor countries have yet to make the transition to nuclear power by 2077, but since poor countries tend to only use small amounts of energy anyway, their demand for oil should also be fairly small (in the grand scheme of the entire world economy). Once the major "consumer" nations (the USA, China, the USSR, the Western European nations, and possibly India) have made the switch to nuclear power, there should be no need to start world wars over oil.

Can anyone explain this or tell where my reasoning or information is wrong?

Fuel is not the only thing oil is used for. Without oil, you e.g. also have no plastics.

I've been giving this one some thought as well and you're right, it wouldn't make sense. It would be like our current Govt's having a war over the last remaning supply of horses whilst having discovered a huge supply of oil.

The only conjecture I could come up with was that the whole nuclear fission and fusion power revolution was a lie (or an overexaggeration) and that the power supplied by these sources was going to be shortlived (possibly a drying up of Uranium?). Hence the U.S. and China were still dependant on oil.

This doesn't standup in the game however as we see fusion and fission power sources still working 200 years after their last maintainance check.

Well, as already stated, oil is not only used for power and fuel, but also many, many, many types of different materials.
Plus, the resource wars weren't only about oil, but also uranium and other supplies.

It's likely that construction of fusion reactors might not even be possible without using materials derived from oil.

Good point, like the current controversy over whether the carbon footprint required to build a nuclear power station (and then decommision it) is worth the zero carbon output while it's in use. I guess you need oil to produce anything in the current economy, even a wind turbine.

I always thought that it was because the US is the one who mastered Fusion tech, and that only a few years before the bombs dropped, and they weren't really willing to share.

There is also the problem of nuclear waste disposal.

A society forced to shift most of its energy production from fossil fuels to nuclear reactors will sooner or later end up in giant masses of dangerous nuclear waste that has to get safely stored somewhere underground for hundreds of years until it looses its radioactivity.

And remember nuclear waste products are not just highly radioactive, they are also chemically highly toxic aswell.


As hinted in Fallout 3 , they already started to store nuclear waste in empty spaces of metro tunnels and buildings. Propably as the waste dumps and mine shafts were already full to capacity.

The waste barrels can be found simply everywhere in the game. Logically as with such a high usage of nuclear power throughout DC and propably the entire country aswell they must have drowned in toxic waste of which nobody knew where to put it anymore. I bet they already started to dump it into the oceans out of desperation. No near their own coasts of course

There are also places which hint that some companies or private persons started to illegally dispose their waste into lakes and caves.

There was also the Fusion technology which does not produce nuclear waste but which was propably so expensive that there was no way to implement it as main energy source or to replace conventional nuclear reactor on larger scale. A real desperate situation without any solution in sight.

Except a nuclear apocalypse of course. lol This solved their problem pretty fast and effective.


So getting as much of the oil left on the planet as possible was the only real "long-term" solution.

Another thing is that uranium does not grow on trees either. Not every country has uranium deposits and with such a high demand in the USA alone, the price for uranium must have skyrocketed aswell and at some point the uranium mines of many countries will be as empty as their oil fields.

Having fusion power means the oil and uranium start to run out in the 2050s instead of the 2010s.

I might be sounding extremely stupid right now but: Are Fission bateries real?
If so couldn't we use them for power? & couldn't the Fallout uni use them for more than just robots?

Thats not a stupid question because yes they are real.


They are called RTGs (Radioisotope thermoelectric generators) but are often refered to as "atomic batteries".

They are used as energy source for space probes and certain satellites.

Especially the soviets built many different types for their space program but also to power unmanned lighthouses in especially remote areas of the arctic.
Check this wikipedia article for an explanation on how they work : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator

It also explain why they are not really an option for large scale usage here on earth.

Fusion had only just advanced to the point where it was possible for a family to have a fusion car... In a positin like Hybrid technology today.

There's also a huge cost in moving from a carbon energy to fusion... building the plants, etc.

The nations of 2077 fought over oil because the fission battery was in its in its early stages of development and was in short suppley (this is because most were shiped off to be used in the U.S.A's power armor soldiers and wepons). There was still alot of objects that only took fossil fuel i.e generators, some cars, tanks, mowers, and flamethrowers ect. Also oil is a esintial in products such as plastic, rubber, and glass. Alothough oil can be replaced in those products but may be more expensive. So when the Resource wars were at thier hieght we needed the oil to give us time to switch over to stuff like nuclear power and fission batterys that where rare at the time. If we didnt get the oil our econmoy and entire country would just stop with almost no fuel to fuel (excpet the luckys with nuclear power and fission battreys.

No unfortanlety, nuclear fission is still a subject that has our top scientists dumbfounded, we know we could do it but we dont know how do do it a efficinet scale. and fallout uses them for wepons the power armor and stuff like elevators and i thinks some cars.

I think you mean FUSION.

He was talking about fission, which we know how to reproduce in mass. And yes, as mentioned before, fission batteries are real, but rather impractical.

And no, fusion is not currently possible in mass. Many of the current experimental set ups can achieve fusion for mere moments. The problem is that the fusion reactors do not produce a positive net power output.

Yeah so far IIRC fusion power as we can do it now needs more power to make then it gives over while it works.

hmm your right but i believe the biggest problem is containment like plasma

My take was that oil was not the only resource in short/dwindling supply - they were probably also running out of all sorts of strategic (titanium, uranium) or even common, industrial materials. Using up the planet and fighting over the last scraps.

Right.
So in conclusion, I think it's safe to agree that the resource wars were not just wars for oil but also for other resources such as uranium.
Two questions strike out to me;

1. As China is nuclear capable, has Chinese nuclear technology allowed for Chinese made nuclear cars?
2. Why did China invade Alaska?
If Alaska was invaded for its oil, it might indicate that there's none or a very limited amount of nuclear cars in China.
Otherwise, it would also indicate that oil and its derived products such as plastic (if I'm not mistaken) are very much in demand.
3. It was mentioned in the Fallout timeline Europe relied on MidEast oil. What happened to oil reserves in the South Americas, Indonesia, and the rest of the Malayan Peninsula? Can it be assumed that those reserves ran out prior the oil talks in 2074?
4. At the 2074 oil talks, the US President stormed out of the meeting and declared that the last known supply of petroleum will be used exclusively by the US and the US will not sell or trade any oil to outside parties. Is he talking about supplies stocked within the United States or are there still foreign sources which are solely pledged to the U.S.?

If some of these questions cannot be answered by existing cannon material, these questions are good materials for fanfics.

It's stated explicitly in the Fallout intro.



Just because they have fission bombs, doesn't mean they had access to cold fusion.



As stated before, fuel is not the only thing oil is needed for.



Or were e.g. taken over by the US, China or the Soviets.

Ah, then I'm curious whether covert operations over resources and geopolitics also played out in the Fallout universe.
More intriguing is whether post-great war enclave is interested or even put effort into acquiring resources outside the pre-great war borders of the United States.