[lore] why would USA annex Canada? : Fallout Series Discussion

» Fri May 27, 2011 10:22 am

I dont get it, I thought Canada will remain ally to USA during the war with China.

why would USA wants to take over Canada ?? Canada is America's closest friend!

» Fri May 27, 2011 8:07 am

The explanation for this is vague, yeah, so it would be great to hear this from others.

» Fri May 27, 2011 8:37 am

It's a strategic thing. The bigger the stronghold the less the enemy can hope to penetrate. Nothing against the canadian people, but I beleive that's inevitable if the US was attacked by such a formitable opponent. The fact that their our allies only really means that we got their back. The U.S. military is way too strong for Canada to really have an effect in coming to our aid. They just don't compare military wise as far as funding and special training is concerned.

» Fri May 27, 2011 8:42 am

Most Canadians will not like this line of thought, so I can see this thread degrading real quick

Two caps from a Canuck living in the USA,

Eileen

» Fri May 27, 2011 10:23 am

It was related to Alaska if I'm not mistaken. Since China invaded Alaska, the US Army would garrison their troops in Canada on the Alaska border, which did not satisfy the canadian population.
And, we canadians are full of useful ressources for the US to use.

» Fri May 27, 2011 2:29 am

Most Canadians will not like this line of thought...

And that's why you moved to the US.

» Fri May 27, 2011 4:16 am

With ressources dwindling, "closest friend" was a relative notion.

IIRC Canada was reluctant to provide what wood an natural ressources to support US war effort toward China, and so was annexed for them - and probably also to facilitate troop moves in the Alaska fight, no more need to bother with a border.

» Fri May 27, 2011 10:37 am

yeah we annexed them for the resources they had

» Fri May 27, 2011 3:21 am

Belongs in Fallout lore.

And if there's anyone who can answer this, it's Ausir.

*Lights the Ausir signal.*

» Fri May 27, 2011 1:39 am

According to the lore, we needed their resources and they objected to us cutting down all those trees. Because as everyone knows, wood is a really major component of modern military hardware.

Personally I think it's because they insisted on calling it "poutine" instead of "freedom fries," but whatever.

» Fri May 27, 2011 4:02 pm

It's a strategic thing. The bigger the stronghold the less the enemy can hope to penetrate. Nothing against the canadian people, but I beleive that's inevitable if the US was attacked by such a formitable opponent. The fact that their our allies only really means that we got their back. The U.S. military is way too strong for Canada to really have an effect in coming to our aid. They just don't compare military wise as far as funding and special training is concerned.

One thing you'd have to understand though, is that the Canadian Military of that era, would have far dwarfed that of its sorry shape today. Remember, the RCN, RCAF and Cdn. Army had a lot better resources, weapons and general esprit de corps, then that of your current "Canadian Forces".

Secondly, a 50's styled Canada, was a place of vast conservatism(unlike today), and many prominent Conservatives, though eager to fight a war against "Bolshevism", would have objected to a foreign power(even us, who are your ally) since this was also a time for National Identity for many Canadians....though you were still sons and daughters of Empire, you were beginning to distinguish yourselves from Old Mother England.

» Fri May 27, 2011 12:21 pm

Its never really explained but the implication is that the main reason for it was a response to the chineese invasion of Alaska. The first reason would be to keep the chineese from pouring into Canada and directly threatening U.S. Boarders. Theres a choke point in between Alaska and Canada; once the chineese poured into Canada they would be much harder to contain. I think it was done preemptively and Canada was probably asked about U.S. troops moving in Advance of a Chineese invasion and The Canadians Hemmed and hawed about it or were afraid it might actually provoke the chineeese and The U.S. just moved in feeling it could not wait for an answer. Thats what I think. Its also possible that the canadian government just collapsed and were attacked. in the video of the first game the troops are reportedly there to keep the peace. Perhaps the Canadian troops were routed and the civilan Government fell. That would explain a lot of things.

» Fri May 27, 2011 4:51 pm

in the video of the first game the troops are reportedly there to keep the peace.

If you can call this peace...
You see a US soldier in a T-51 armor shooting a Canadian prisoner in the head, then saluting the camera.

» Fri May 27, 2011 1:56 am

If you can call this peace...
You see a US soldier in a T-51 armor shooting a Canadian prisoner in the head, then saluting the camera.

Sometimes, the best way to put down a resistance movement, is through a show of force!

» Fri May 27, 2011 5:21 pm

Too bad the UN was dissolved but then again, seeing what's happening in Gaza in real life, I doubt there's much they can do about it. It's the Security Council and the 5 permanent members' veto power!

» Fri May 27, 2011 6:08 am

One thing you'd have to understand though, is that the Canadian Military of that era, would have far dwarfed that of its sorry shape today. Remember, the RCN, RCAF and Cdn. Army had a lot better resources, weapons and general esprit de corps, then that of your current "Canadian Forces".

Secondly, a 50's styled Canada, was a place of vast conservatism(unlike today), and many prominent Conservatives, though eager to fight a war against "Bolshevism", would have objected to a foreign power(even us, who are your ally) since this was also a time for National Identity for many Canadians....though you were still sons and daughters of Empire, you were beginning to distinguish yourselves from Old Mother England.

All true. But the time period that the bombs fell was 2077, not 1950's. I would agree that they were more of a force back then but that's not when they got annexed. According to the timeline, we annexed them in the future from our current real life time period. So they would have been how they are today. Good points though.

EDIT: Sorry, I'm pretty sure I got this wrong. I just remembered that the news article you read in the news facility probably had an earlier date on it, which I neglected to pay any attention to. Whoops.

» Fri May 27, 2011 3:30 am

If you can call this peace...
You see a US soldier in a T-51 armor shooting a Canadian prisoner in the head, then saluting the camera.

Yes, in the first two games it was abundantly clear that Canada was steamrolled by a much more aggressive America, leading to an American occupation and Annexation.

The other issue was by that point in time, there were no more 'friends.' Resources were low with everyone and Oil, the main cause of the war, was in extremely short supply. The Trans-Alaskan Pipe line ran through Canada, and in Fallout 3 there were reports in the news paper officer and elsewhere of the pipeline being sabotaged and our troops being denied rights of passage. Therefore, I must conclude two (not necessarily contradictory possibilities.)

1. Canada was in fact sabotaging the effort, Seeing both China and America as equal threats to it's existance, or,
2. America manufactured a cause to gain access to the oil resources and wood resources of Canada.

» Fri May 27, 2011 8:04 am

If you can call this peace...
You see a US soldier in a T-51 armor shooting a Canadian prisoner in the head, then saluting the camera.

he executed a rioter

all soldiers were ordered to shoot canadian rioters on sight

well at least i think it was a rioter

» Fri May 27, 2011 6:39 am

Though, either way...its inevitable that you Canadians will eventually join us. To be honest, Canadians are Americans. So for the United States to Annex Canada, its simply us completing our Manifest Destiny!!

» Fri May 27, 2011 9:06 am

Here's a question for all our Canucks out there:

If you were living in the Fallout Universe....

Would you fight under this Flag:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/97/Flag_of_Canada_1921.svg

Or this Flag:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Flag_of_Canada.svg

» Fri May 27, 2011 7:34 am

Here's a question for all our Canucks out there:

If you were living in the Fallout Universe....

Would you fight under this Flag:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/97/Flag_of_Canada_1921.svg

Or this Flag:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Flag_of_Canada.svg

Actually I'd fight under another flag than these two, but that will bring political wrath to the thread. Let's stick to the question at hand, which is Why would USA annex Canada.

» Fri May 27, 2011 4:22 pm

Canada's Timeline

Canada makes its first appearance in the history of the Fallout universe in 2059, though only in the Fallout Bible timeline (all following notes are from the Fallout Bible timeline unless mentioned otherwise)[2]:

2059

* The Anchorage Front Line is established, as the United States increases its military presence in Alaska to protect its oil interests. The Anchorage Front Line causes tensions in the United States and Canada, as the United States attempts to pressure Canada into allowing American military units to guard the Alaskan pipeline.

2066

* Winter: As a sign of increasing tension between the two countries, Canada proves reluctant to allow American troops on Canadian soil or allow American planes to fly over Canadian airspace. The United States and Canadian tensions rise, but Canada eventually backs down, and US troops pass through Canada. This sets the stage for the Canadian annexation (which occurs in 2076).

2069

* Canada begins to feel the pressure from the United States military as the US draws upon Canadian resources for the war effort. Vast stretches of timberland are destroyed, and other resources in Canada are stretched to the breaking point. Many Americans refer to Canada as Little America, and Canadian protests are unheard.

2072

* The United States' increasing demand for Canadian resources causes protests and riots in several Canadian cities. An attempted sabotage of the Alaskan pipeline is all the military needs as an excuse to begin its annexation of Canada... which in fact, had already begun in 2067.

2076

* January: The United States annexation of Canada is complete. Canadian protesters and rioters are shot on sight, and the Alaskan Pipeline swarms with American military units under the command of Buzz Babcock. Pictures of atrocities make their way to the United States, causing further unrest and protests.

2077

* January 22: The first domestic use of Power Armor within the United States for crowd and quarantine control. Units originally serving in China and the Anchorage Front Line find themselves fighting Americans at home. Food riots increase, and many civilians are killed. Several soldiers defect from the military both in Canada and the United States. They are captured, and are sent to military prisons.

That's from the Fallout Wiki, looks like one the earlier user got it right.

» Fri May 27, 2011 7:22 am

Though it's hard to find, the newspaper's building is in the game. It contains computers where you can read the whole story.

» Fri May 27, 2011 1:29 pm

Would you fight under this Flag:

I prefer to fight from underneath a shelter, but to answer your question even though I'm not Canadian, I would not fight under any flag since I much prefer to fight for something I believe in and pretty colored cloths are not on my list.

» Fri May 27, 2011 2:59 pm

Belongs in Fallout lore.

And if there's anyone who can answer this, it's Ausir.

*Lights the Ausir signal.*

Anyone could answer it by simply checking the Canada article in the wiki - and someone did.