Will there be an alert for nearby enemies?

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:16 am

I would really like some sort of system to show you where enemies and hostile creatures are surrounding you. Fallout has a system that displayed a red 'bleep' on a mini compass. Does anyone know if this or anything like it will be included??

Regardless, would you like something like this in ES?

If not, I sure hope that detect life will be in.
User avatar
lucile davignon
 
Posts: 3375
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:40 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:59 pm

I think it's less needed than in Fallout 3, because in FO3 most people had guns so it was important to spot them from a distance. And it made the Perception stat a little less useless. :P
User avatar
Julie Ann
 
Posts: 3383
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 5:17 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:36 am

i personally turned the blips off in FO3 as it ruined immersion for me. but i would like detect life to be better implemented this time around
User avatar
jennie xhx
 
Posts: 3429
Joined: Wed Jun 21, 2006 10:28 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:26 am

No! I want npcs to be able to sneak on me. Think of the spider in the cave, if I see it on the radar where's the excitement when it silently drops from the ceiling?
User avatar
Shelby McDonald
 
Posts: 3497
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2007 2:29 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:11 pm

You might want to look into Detect life or Detect Undead spells, just enchant it to your helmet if you arnt a mage.
User avatar
brandon frier
 
Posts: 3422
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:47 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:36 pm

Red dots or stripes indicating enemies is the last thing I want to see on the compass of Skyrim, it just so much better in TES when you don't know where enemies are all the time, one of the reasons I usually play with perception 1 in Fallout, except when I play the Sneak critical type who needs better criticals.
User avatar
Stephanie I
 
Posts: 3357
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:28 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:01 am

I hope not, can be an immersion killer for me.
User avatar
BlackaneseB
 
Posts: 3431
Joined: Sat Sep 23, 2006 1:21 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:14 pm

i personally turned the blips off in FO3 as it ruined immersion for me. but i would like detect life to be better implemented this time around


I dont really get how the blips ruin immersion but detect life didnt.

I dunno, to be honest I see where you guys are coming from, but it seems like your being a bit dramatic. I never had trouble 'immersing' (< seems to be a forum favorite) myself in Fallout. Guess I will just settle with detect life, although If anything that is just as bad in my opinion....even though detect life never stopped me from being 'immersed' in Oblivion.

I guess different people have different tastes. I'll tell you though what ruined immersion from me. Hearing a stupid 'enemies nearby' theme all the time... and looking around and not seeing anything. That theme playing ruined immersion by telling you immediately, so I dont see how the blips really push it over the edge.
User avatar
gemma
 
Posts: 3441
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2006 7:10 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:25 pm

I didn't mind the red blips in FO3, because it sort of fitted in the the sort of futuro-pipboy thing. And often you saw the enemy before the blip came on. I agree that the red "blips" in FO3 and FO:NV didn't ruin the effect or Immersion. Nonetheless, I hope Skyrim doesn't implement this, because although it suits Fallouts futuristic ideals, I doubt it would be very fitting in ESV.
User avatar
Saul C
 
Posts: 3405
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:41 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:19 am

I would really like some sort of system to show you where enemies and hostile creatures are surrounding you. Fallout has a system that displayed a red 'bleep' on a mini compass. Does anyone know if this or anything like it will be included??

Regardless, would you like something like this in ES?


Not just no, but hell no! Fallout also had a decent explanation for that "bleep"- the Pip-Boy strapped to your arm. Which also served to explain the "Magic GPS Quest Arrow" which I hope Skyrim does away with.

If not, I sure hope that detect life will be in.


It should, and Pip-Boy features shouldn't.
User avatar
Alexis Acevedo
 
Posts: 3330
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:58 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:43 am

Not just no, but hell no! Fallout also had a decent explanation for that "bleep"- the Pip-Boy strapped to your arm. Which also served to explain the "Magic GPS Quest Arrow" which I hope Skyrim does away with.



It should, and Pip-Boy features shouldn't.


I like your enthusiasim, but the 'blip' was on the compass, not the pip boy. If you ever play Fallout, check out the 'perception' skill, that determines when these blips appear. It was NOT as if increasing your perception upgraded your pip boy, it upgraded your awareness.

The 'magic gps quest arrow' was convenient, and was also used in previous elder scrolls games. Simply put, most people would like to know where they are going without having to pull up the map every four seconds. Its nice to have a marker to guide you without using the menu. For the people who put a lot of time into these games, these little shortcuts are welcomed. Regardless of whethere the bleeps would work or not, removing that is a bad idea to me.

So instead of 'magic gps arrows' I guess we will just settle for a detect life enchantment, and hop on our dragons, while casting spells.
User avatar
Alex [AK]
 
Posts: 3436
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2007 10:01 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:45 pm

I didn't mind the red blips in FO3, because it sort of fitted in the the sort of futuro-pipboy thing. And often you saw the enemy before the blip came on. I agree that the red "blips" in FO3 and FO:NV didn't ruin the effect or Immersion. Nonetheless, I hope Skyrim doesn't implement this, because although it suits Fallouts futuristic ideals, I doubt it would be very fitting in ESV.

Yes it reminded me of the detector in the Alien movie, and yes detect life was far more powerful as is wallhack. I regularly shoot at enemies before I could see them sometimes I also shoot over a hill as in beyond visible range.
Only way the dots could be back would be for some other sense like smell, no it would not work for humans or other races with small noses :)
User avatar
CHANONE
 
Posts: 3377
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 10:04 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:54 pm

I dont really get how the blips ruin immersion but detect life didnt.

I guess different people have different tastes. I'll tell you though what ruined immersion from me. Hearing a stupid 'enemies nearby' theme all the time... and looking around and not seeing anything. That theme playing ruined immersion by telling you immediately, so I dont see how the blips really push it over the edge.

red blips made me look around constantly and expect enemies (specially at perception 10). blips did to me what battle music did for you i guess. when i turned them off, i was on edge in dangerous zones most of the time. a bit like the difference between fog of war or no fog of war in RTS games.

also, detect like has to be cast, and not everyone had it.

finally, i turn music off in all my RPGs for "immersion" purposes too. i used to have blips and music on too till i read suggestions to turn them off and ive never gone back since.
User avatar
Claudz
 
Posts: 3484
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 5:33 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:38 am

red blips made me look around constantly and expect enemies (specially at perception 10). blips did to me what battle music did for you i guess. when i turned them off, i was on edge in dangerous zones most of the time. a bit like the difference between fog of war or no fog of war in RTS games.

also, detect like has to be cast, and not everyone had it.

finally, i turn music off in all my RPGs for "immersion" purposes too. i used to have blips and music on too till i read suggestions to turn them off and ive never gone back since.


I understand, although I like the music personally so I always play with that on.

My main gripe about Oblivion not having this system, is that you did not know if the people you were appoaching were enemies or not, until you approached them and they attacked you. It would be nice to have some way of knowing who was violently going to attack you, and who is just waiting in the middle of no where to give you a quest.
User avatar
Cody Banks
 
Posts: 3393
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2007 9:30 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:26 pm

They've told us that they're going for no hud this time around. The only thing we'll have to go on will be sound then. Hopefully the music won't kick in till we get hit/hit someone.

What they could do would be the higher your agility, the sooner the normal music goes quiet. With it going quiet whenever you go into sneek or when you're character detects something would allow for the player to listen harder for footsteps, voices, or other noises. Then the combat music would kick in when you got hit, or you find whom ever is sneeking up on you and hit them.
User avatar
Stacey Mason
 
Posts: 3350
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 6:18 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:28 am

I certainly hope not.
I also hope there will be no battle music.

I want enemy attacks to be a surprise. Not something you can prepare yourself for by listening to a somewhat silly music-change or by looking at a red dot on your screen.
That's kinda cheap and shallow for a game, I think.
But maybe that's just me.
User avatar
Melung Chan
 
Posts: 3340
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:15 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:51 pm

No! I want npcs to be able to sneak on me. Think of the spider in the cave, if I see it on the radar where's the excitement when it silently drops from the ceiling?

I second that. Surprise attacks are more desirable in magic&swords fantasy than in sci-fi shooters. In Far Cry the dots on the radar were cool and sometimes necessary (snipers, turrets) but in Tes I'd hate to have them.
User avatar
Hella Beast
 
Posts: 3434
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 2:50 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:46 pm

I certainly hope not.
I also hope there will be no battle music.

I want enemy attacks to be a surprise. Not something you can prepare yourself for by listening to a somewhat silly music-change or by looking at a red dot on your screen.
That's kinda cheap and shallow for a game, I think.
But maybe that's just me.


Some people like to play the game the complete opposite. Instead of 'wanting to be snuck up on', some people like to do the sneaking themselves. If every attack in the game was a surprise one, it wouldnt be very fun at all. Id constantly be getting snuck up on, and attacked.

The 'surprise' element is understandable however, but standing (or sneaking) next to a npc and not being able to identify them as hostile or non-hostiles makes no sense. So what do I just stand up and say "Hey! Are you a good guy or a bad guy? Because that is even less realistic than being able to 'sense' when there is a person or thing 5 feet away from you.
User avatar
James Baldwin
 
Posts: 3366
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:11 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:59 pm

No radar please
User avatar
Liii BLATES
 
Posts: 3423
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 10:41 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:00 am

Some people like to play the game the complete opposite. Instead of 'wanting to be snuck up on', some people like to do the sneaking themselves. If every attack in the game was a surprise one, it wouldnt be very fun at all. Id constantly be getting snuck up on, and attacked.

The 'surprise' element is understandable however, but standing (or sneaking) next to a npc and not being able to identify them as hostile or non-hostiles makes no sense. So what do I just stand up and say "Hey! Are you a good guy or a bad guy? Because that is even less realistic than being able to 'sense' when there is a person or thing 5 feet away from you.


1) You will still be able to sneak without battle music or a radar. The only difference is that enemies that come rushing to you from some direction won't be as notable. And you wouldn't be able to sneak from them anyway. The attack would still happen.
Still, nothing stops you from using detect life. So to say that no battle music or no radar eliminates sneaking, is definitely not true.

2) What's more realistic...
to hear a battle music whenever an enemy notices you, despite you haven't noticed them yet, and to have a magical radar on your screen, as if you came from the 22th century...
or to just be a bit surprised from time to time with no notification that an enemy is rushing to you? The only notification you'd receive would be with your eyes (seeing the enemy), or with your hears (hearing the enemy's footsteps or w/e).

Also, what would be more realistic...
magically sensing who's bad and good and placing the bad as a red dot on a magical radar, as if you came from the 22th century...
or using your head and think a bit, depending on where you are (in a dungeon for instance) and how the supposedly enemy-character looks like, to find out whether he/she is an enemy or not?

I'm exaggerating a bit to say that thing from the 22th century, but it's kinda true at the same time. There is no radar in TES from what I know, and it shouldn't be that either. You should plan your attacks by thinking, not by looking mindlessly at some red dot at a magical radar or hearing some music-change. If you aren't alert, then you won't be alert for nearby enemies. It's as simple as that, and that's how it should be like, imo.
User avatar
Solina971
 
Posts: 3421
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:40 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:19 pm

Bandits and friends often dressed the same. I was always afraid to execute my attacks because I'd be worried I'd kill a good guy :cryvaultboy:.

The blips on your compass aren't an answer though. Maybe the bandits should have tattoos, or something to give them away.
User avatar
Catherine N
 
Posts: 3407
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2007 9:58 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:02 pm

Detect life, undead, and magic, combined with night eye, animal eye, and heat vision should be all we need. Although perception/awareness is a common RPG stat, I find it hard to include it, and get good gameplay from it, in a CRPG without going the Fallout way. Not sure how I would include perception/awareness/6th-sense in Skyrim. Maybe something like:
Background of compass changes *gradually* from green, yellow, red depending on safe, caution, and danger modes, to reflect the 6th-sense of *the character*? They could also check out Arma2 and how it uses blobs to increase the situational awareness. But most importantly, it have to be user controlled; don't force anything upon us, some prefer the ultra immersion, while others are more casual about it. When activated in Arma2, lowest difficulty would show them *on screen*, increase difficulty to show them only when outside of view, then they were removed at the more realistic modes. Then again, Arma2 tries to be a realistic oriented game, where realism and reduced screen resolution don't blend well.

If some want radar, screen blobs, music cues - let them. But it annoys me that I have to use mods to get rid of things I don't want. Personally I also play without music for added immersion, but I'm sure some would want to the music but without the warning effect it has. Forcing it on the console players is what makes them casual. I'm pretty sure there are console players who would have wanted a more immersive experience, but "no mods allowed" won't let them have it.
User avatar
Emily Graham
 
Posts: 3447
Joined: Sat Jul 22, 2006 11:34 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:00 am

Stop comparing TES and Fallout in this context.

In Fallout 1 and 2 you could see any given person/enemy at any given time since it's an isometric game. The radar was just a system to bring this into fallout 3.

TES on the other hand has never had radar and doesn't need it.
User avatar
Rachell Katherine
 
Posts: 3380
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2006 5:21 pm

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:22 pm

music will let you know :spotted owl:
User avatar
Stacyia
 
Posts: 3361
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2006 12:48 am

Post » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:22 pm

Either that or you hit "T" to rest and are told you can't because there are enemies around, which is what I do.

BTW, as I understand it, it's not there won't be a HUD it's that the HUD will only appear when it's necessary. So if you're just strolling along and nothing's attacking you it won't be there, but if a troll jumps at you there'll be a HUD showing your health and other necessary information. At least that's what I understood from, I think, Todd's interview.
User avatar
Penny Courture
 
Posts: 3438
Joined: Sat Dec 23, 2006 11:59 pm

Next

Return to V - Skyrim