I understand it perfectly, and my statement stands. Fallout 3's so-called "story" was naught but a mashup of Fallout and Fallout 2. Unless what you mean is that "mad copypasta skillz" and "good story writing skills" are one and the same, in which case let's hope they copy from something good for Skyrim.




That's kinda what I said- and I got brushed off with some nonsense about not knowing the difference between story and dialogue.

i dont know the story of Morrowind, i played but never beaten

I'll at least give them credit to the F bomb you drop on Colonel Autumn when you get captured.

I am fine with the stories in the elder scrolls games. I don't find them any worse than other RPGs. Heck IMO the story was just as good as Mass effect 1 & 2 and they get praise for their stories. The difference IMO is the Mass effect style of game are better at telling you the story, where as in the elder scrolls you are telling the story. You have to kind of work to find the whole stories and tell them in a coherent fashion, if you do a main quest story leave the cliff hanger hanging for a year as you do side quests and then amble back to it the main story will suffer, if you don't read any of the books the main story will suffer etc. It is sort of the difference between books and movies, movies tell you the story for you, books you have to actual imagine the story or tell the story to your self effectively.

I don't worry much about the main quest. I expect it to pretty much svck. Beth has to tailor this game to hold the attention of all the 12 year olds who are going to spend their allowances on it, which means the main quest is going to have to be shallow, simple, obvious and easy to follow. Would that it wasn't, but it will be.

What I worry is that they're going to spend so much time and resources on putting together the big spectacle for the casual players that they're going to end up cutting out too much of the rest of the game - all the little details that made Oblivion playable in spite of its lame main quest. I've played dozens of characters in Oblivion over thousands of hours, and I've only done the main quest twice. I've spent all the rest of that time just following characters around as they live whatever lives they live in Cyrodiil. And I'm afraid that Beth is going to cut so much of the meat out of Skyrim in order to make room for flash that it won't be possible to do that.

Really? :facepalm:

Yeah, that is what I thought when I read his post. I have played about three times as much vanilla Oblivion on the 360 as I have modded Oblivion on the PC....

A lot of you guys seem to think cliche is necessarily a bad thing. Some cliches are comforting, especially in a fantasy setting.

It's a cliche to take a girl out for a romantic dinner. But that doesn't mean it isn't enjoyable, or expected for that matter...

Morrowind : Dunno, tried the game only a few minutes, only had good voices.
Oblivion : Not that good, Martin is godlike even though you did everything
Fallout 3 : I liked it to be honest.

I thought the Morrowind and Oblivion MQ's were both pretty unique/interesting. I never once thought they were cliche or actually anything like what you are describing. :shrug:

Edit*
Fallout 3's as well.

I don't understand why so many people disliked Oblivion's story. I loved it. The seige of kvatch was great, cloud ruler temple, battle for bruma, the mission where you go through the imperial sewers w/ Baurus to meet the Mythic Dawn.

i liked them all. but about skyrim we wont know until that grand November morning (i hope theres a very gentle snow fall on that day)
but i dont know the game has dragons (that look incredible from what we have seen) and your saving the world from being destroyed not just one country or one continent. all of nirn is in trouble unless you the dragon born stop him and banish the dragons forever. seems like itl be a very good story maybe il get to doing after i get bored with exploring and fighting beasts monsters dwemer animunculi and bandits and the occaisional dragon(unlikely).

yeh I dont get why people say it is cliche either, if you think about it, it is pretty interesting

Eh, im really expecting a big Conan vibe, they did sort of confirm thats what they're aiming for. And I actually think the story for Skyrim might be damn incredible. Very Macbethy

Keep in mind Bethesda isn't making Skyrim up as they go, the story fits into the lore that has existed for years.

1) Dragons have been in ES lore for a long time, so they where bound too appear someday. Dragonlings appeared in DF, for instance, and I think a dragon featured in Redguard(needs confirmation). Just though I should mention that
2) Can I say I liked all the Stories? I know OB was kinda cliche, but I liked it. MW was kinda a cliche too, since it is about a destined hero that have too stop an ancient evil. But they are both good stories. Nothing bad too say about FO3s story other than that I hope they make it longer this time.

Dungeons and Dragons.

Wait...

Agreed! I love how some people just like to use words like cliche wether or not they understand what it really means or not, just because they think it makes them sound intelligent or articulate..LMAO..People are so cliche when they say cliche

This thread was doomed from the beginning. This must stop. This thread is a poison that is spreading the word "cliché" around like a plague. :banghead: :swear:

I swear, the next time I hear someone say that IRL, they will receive a destructive kick to their procreation equipment. Not even joking a little bit. :nono:

Infuriating thread is infuriating.

Aah.... that's one of my favorite bits of forum rhetoric - the whole idea that people who use precise language, and particularly those who tend to use multisyllabic words, are doing it on purpose so that they'll sound intelligent.

It always says more about the author than it does the subject.....

Agreed. "You think you're all that, but you're not!" is the same as saying "You say big words to sound smart, but we all no your dum!"

I find the trend of this topic to be rather amusing. Technically, to find something cliche, one would have to be enough of a bookworm or comic book nerd or movie watcher to have experienced enough literature with similar plots and devices. The word "meme" comes to mind suddenly. I also agree that just because something is cliche doesn't make it bad, unless you engorged yourself on a huge amount of similar content and now are full of it. And I totally get where those people are coming from. Lets have more female action heroes already! Male action heroes seem too cliche!

So the moral of the story is to avoid being too cultured, avoid cliche materials like the plague, and don't allow yourself to get used to any one plot type. You are just setting yourself up for disappointment because we all know, at least us educated types know, that every plot has been thought of, and copied 100 times, and then mixed with another copied plot 100 times.

So what if the story is not so great? That is the great thing about TES series games that I have come to expect. Not a bad storyline, but a great open world, where you could have a ton of freedom and even avoid every quest altogether if you wish. In my opinion, as time passes and technology improves, the story in the TES series will only become less and less integral, and just the whole scope and variety of the world will engulf the player. Perhaps that is the whole idea behind the mediocre storytelling.

Another theory would be that they didn't have enough quest master talent, and so they increased their staff to 100 or so, which probably includes an entire story production crew, correct me if I'm wrong.

The thing I like the best about ES games...you don't have to do the main quest to have a BLAST.

Wow I'm very surprised to see morrowind winning so much. You basically go to some places and cut some people up... and although F3's story was probably better than oblivion's, you cant play after finishing it which svcks, so I voted oblivion.

Does anyone know what was the point of Oblivion technically from the game developers point of view? For example, this time around (Skyrim) they said the main point is to create a ton of variety and quality and uniqueness, etc. Basically customization. I vaguely recall that someone said that Oblivion's main point was to make it easier to use or something? And perhaps Morrowind's main focus was on the huge open world and inventiveness of the main story... You see where I'm going with this?

Maybe that's because when you live in a post-apocalyptic and you're a hero, you generally wanna try to make the world a lil less apocalyptic. Besides turf wars and reviving the world, which was focused on in New Vegas, there's not really many more overarching conflicts in the wasteland that you can focus an entire game on. It's the locations and the people in the game that matter.

Personally, I think FO3 had a pretty good story, and Oblivion's was by far the worst. I've never played right through Morrowind, though. I've tried but after starting with Oblivion I just can't play Morrowind for very long xD