I want....more bricks....oars....stuff that would be useful if you could use but otherwise add a certain....decor feeling...maybe a severed nord leg....blood potion/bottles that actually count for vampires/werewolves, ummm...lanterns,lamps,candles,lights/torches, stuff like that....they should have value...and I wouldnt mind duplication glitch for us xbox players as we cannot make extra items without using a glitch like that in oblivion with bows/scrolls I liked it in that it gave me extras of the little things.....like those rare one of a kind items....that may not be valuable but to me they were...pricless lol.

Silverware and jewelry weren't worth enough if you ask me. At the same time, though, one thing I always hated about Oblivion was that there wasn't very much to spend your money on. If you make items worth more then you get more neat stuff to buy with your loot cash, but you also get more when you steal these things. It's a zero-sum game.

Then again you could raise the price for everything in the game, but just set it up so that fences pay significantly less than value.

Compare to Fallout 3, or New Vegas, where you can Steal some of the best weapons in the game. For example, the Trail Carbine in Ranger Andy's bungalow. The Lever Action Shotgun in Boulder City.

Stealing a handful of rings and a book, isn't enticing to a thief, when you can just go kill a Marauder and get a full set of Daedric with much less effort.




How did they get the first pitcher in the first place anyway? I don't see a kiln in any Pawnbroker shop in Oblivion.



Again, we can look at New Vegas, more so than any Bethesda Developed game, as an example of "Doing it Right". The Economy, for the most part, in New Vegas, was pretty well balanced. You had reason to Horde your caps early in the game, since you could walk into the Brotherhood of Steel armory, and purchase a Riot Shotgun, or .45-70 Lever action at any level (I've seen them both as low as Lv.3).

Stolen items themselves, shouldn't be tagged unless it's witnessed. While you should never be able to sell a stolen item back to the Original owner, if you're a good thief, and manage to swipe some goods without getting caught, there's no reason that you shouldn't be able to sell the item, at worst, in a different county/hold.

Of course, if you get caught stealing, the infamous "Red Hand" approach can be taken, and that's when the fences can be used.

New Vegas's Economy had one thing working in it's favor though, Ammunition. No Elder Scrolls game really has such an omnipresent consumable built into the core of the game, the way as the Fallout Titles. The only way I see an Economy in Skyrim being balanced, is if Weapons and Armor become much more costly to maintain (IE, no more 10 gold hammers)

I agree with previous posters who say there should be more denominations of money than just gold.

I always loved those games that had a multi-denomination or multi-unit monetary system. You scrounge around for copper pieces when you first start out, and when you finally get that first gold piece the feeling is like... WOW!

Three big problems with this system for developers and gameplay are:

1) That it makes every financial interface more complex, from the shop keeper interface to the loot interface.

2) It confuses many players who may think they have far less (or more) real wealth than they actually have.

3) After you play for a certain number of hours, all but the highest denomination coin becomes irrelevant anyway.

Usually, it all gets reduced to gold for these reasons. I still think a copper/silver/gold system would be fantastic though

I agree that Oblivion's economic system was seriously out of balance. Wasn't there an NPC that said she couldn't make 5 gold in a year, but basic foodstuff could cost 3 gold. So yes to copper, solver, gold coins. Complexity wouldn't bother me, I'm old enough to remember the British pre decimal system. 12 pennies to a shilling, 20 shillings to a pound!

Yeah, the benefit is for realism, but not to make it more realistic, but to make it less so.
Is it really so realistic that your money, out of nowhere changes into something else?

Is it realistic to have 97 copper, get 5 more, and suddenly have 1 silver and 2 copper, just like that? I can answer that for you: no, it's not...

And silverware did have a price in Oblivion, both when selling and buying.
And do you really think a trader would buy a paintbrush from you? really? If so, you should try bringing a paint brush to a store, and see how much they'll give for it... No wait, I can answer that for you as well: Nothing...

My point isn't so much that these items wouldn't be worth something in real life. It's more along the lines of: There's really no tangible benefit to my game in giving them value. Whether something is worth zero or worth a couple copper, does it really matter? I can't accept the immersion argument in this case. Realism for immersion can be good. Realism for realism-sake is something different. As far as the game world, the items you speak of are worhtless... they have no value to me; I don't want them in my house; I don't want them in my inventory. Immersion doesn't take any hit for me.

If they go ahead and make all the useless clutter worth 1 gold, that's fine really. If they leave it at zero, that's fine too. I probably won't notice either way. But really, try taking a clay pot to a compra-venta here in the Dominican Republic and see what they'll give you for it. Because that's more closely anolgous to the trading in OB. They won't give you 1 peso. I just think it's easy to get way too carried away with the idea of realism and immersion... and this feels like one of those instances for me.

It was sold by the ones making them, not by random people passing through.
Why would someone want to buy a pitcher that you found in a dungeon from you? Most likely, it wouldn't even be clean, and not fit for reselling.

or WoW :hubbahubba:

But yeah I agree, this was actually one of the things in WoW that I found really nice, at least as a first impressional thing. AoC had the same, but they overdid it a little by adding Tin (0.01 copper).

Cheapest silverware item, the fork, was worth 2 coins not nothing.


They aren't worth the effort on the merchant part to buy them for you to try to resell them later that's all.

Fractional money is a flapjack idea. I totally agree with you there. I also agree completely that some items are worth nothing. The paintbrush is a perfect example. Another good example would be used clay cups, or used dirty clothes. Who would buy them? Nobody.

BUT, some items in Oblivion were worthless that probably should not have been. More "junk" should have been like the folds of cloth that were worth 4 or 10 gold. I like to see some clutter that is worth something now and then mixed in like armorer's hammers. That way I can pick through a house and at least have a selection of things that are worth taking.

Fine silver was worth 1-20 some odd gold in Oblivion. That's nonsensical to me too. I dont' remember the exact numbers, but I know you could go to a castle and steal all the silver in the whole place and not make enough money to... well... well nothing because there's nothing to buy in Oblivion. The whole economic system was pancakes. They need to do it from the ground up.

Hey! Good news everybody! -They've announced a million years ago that they are rebuilding the economy from the ground up. I, for one, am glad to hear it.

And I am glad too!
I totally agree that the economic system in Oblivion svcked, and am glad that they are rebuilding it from scratch!
Some things should stay at worthless, while other things should have a value.

It just irritates me to see people saying that having copper, silver and gold is more realistic, when it's less realistic than paying with grass!

Somehow, I don't think the proprietor of the establishment is going to check your earthenware pitcher's background. And, you know, looking at the useless "Junk" in the game, they all look pretty clean, definitely as clean as the ones you buy in the store, so where did you draw that argument from?

so copper turning into silver is unrealistic, yeah. true story. but lugging around 343,423 gold coins isn't? and the items i was using were just examples... I can't say i remember exactly what had value and what didn't in Oblivion. I'm just making a point. Everything has a price. It's basic economics. TINSTAAFL. ever heard of that? it's an acronym for 'there is no such thing as a free lunch'

i don't care if my examples were off. my point still stands. its realistic for things to have value, even if its minuscule. besides, the houses in Oblivion didnt have anything but crap anyways... so if you rob someone you have no real choice but to steal silverware and spools and fabric and pot plates. so even giving it a little bit of value so i can make a profit is better than giving it absolutely no value at all.

Most dungeons can't afford a maid to come in and clean all of the clay jugs.

Well, they might look clean, but think about it: If you find a pitcher in the sewers, do you think it's clean?

---

and Maxx0021, I totally agree that carrying all those septims is unrealistic, but let's not make something that is unrealistic even more unrealistic, eh?
And yes, like I said, I agree that a lot of things in Oblivion should have had a value, but I do not agree that EVERY item should have a value.

The most likely way to make carrying septims realistic has actually been done by mods before, make them weigh something!
If every Septim had a weight, you couldn't carry too much, and would have to store them somewhere. It's a pain in the ass when you get a lot of money, but hey, if you want realism, you gotta pay for it...

I dont necessarily disagree, but what about garage sales? i'm not saying you can sell crumpled paper at a garage sale, but a clay pot? you bet your behind i could sell a pot for ten cents. some poor sap will buy it. a paintbrush too. just because i'm traveling to different places to barter in Skyrim doesn't mean people wont buy my junk.

A Few points.

1: This is a Fantasy setting game, based around many assumptions taken from up to the Fall of the Roman Empire. The Correlation between Bacteria and disease wasn't made until well after the Christian Dark Ages, some thousand years later. They really don't know what constitutes as "Unsanitary"

2: Even if they do, just cast fireball on a pot of water, and pour it inside. Instantly sanitized for resale.

First, you're preaching to the choir. EVERYONE hated that almost everything (save enchanted items) was undervalued. Most weapons were never worth looting because the items were worth so damn little for how much they weighed. In most cases, upper class clothing cost LESS than poor clothing (mostly with items that covered your top and legs at the same time). Things like that really pissed off a LOT of players.

Second, in the unlikely event that they blow this aspect of the game off and undervalue everything again, there's always the mod kit. :3

Now we're getting at the larger issue here, I think. In the end, it's futile arguing if something is worth 0 gold or 1 gold, because there's no tangible benefit in either side. Now if they create an economy where being a trader is actually a viable means of making a living... and they give us a reason to actually walk into a store and buy something... then they're making progress.

I'm going to search for posts on improving economy, because I haven't checked into any of them yet.

Look if you take an object from someone's house or you find it in the sewers or a cave or wheretheheck... it's used. You have to assume that anything you take to a merchant is used, no matter where you got it. Call it clean, call it pre-owned, refurbished, I don't care. It's used.

Who wants used underwear? Used clay mugs? I can get a new clay mug for 1 gold thanks, I don't need your used one for the same price. How about the paintbrush example? A lousy paintbrush in the real world costs pennies. I don't need that used one you found at the bottom of the river, thanks.

An item is worth what someone will pay for it. Some things are worthless. It's a fact.

Anyone else see the HUGE contradiction in the first point there?
You first state that it's a fantasy setting game, then you start rambling about how things are in real life...

How do you know that they aren't aware of the bacteria and diseases? Well, I know they are aware of it... There's even a special tab for diseases in the menu!^^

Oh, and second point is just silly.. Everyone knows a fireball would totally destroy that pot!

I lol'd on all counts. Also see my point right above yours, it doesn't even matter if it's clean or not.

How about a "flea market" of sorts? I think that would actually be an interesting addition. Sell your useless junk, if you're carrying any. And maybe even find a hidden treasure... a skill book that the vendor doesn't know the true value of, an enchanted item that just needs to be polished up a bit to work. Get scammed buying a "Ring of Burden" with a different name. Add some mystery to the mercantile experience.

First off, you're trying so hard, you're missing the obvious.

Just because I know I have a disease by the symptoms (Reduced Strength or whatever) doesn't mean I know a tiny, microscopic creature is responsible.

Second, if you just read a little more, I pointed out, even if they did know, it's not a justifiable reason, because sanitizing is a very simple process.