Exactly my thoughts. Quest markers aren't a bad idea (imo), but in Oblivion they were overdone, showing you the exact location of everything no matter whether you could know about it or not. In Morrowind on the other hand it was extremely annoying to search for a dungeon entrance for half an hour sometimes. Didn't feel like exploring, it felt like a chore.

I would like to politely DEMAND the ability to negate questmarkers!

Keep the markers. Markers are good. Some, can be easily substituted by Journal entries, dialogue or simple exploration, some - do not. If markers are not present, it will require much of something else to substitute them. One can't just take them off. Because it will require a huge amount of work to substitute markers, I am not sure it is worth the time. I prefer Bethesda to work on the other aspects of the game. At any rate, the "No Green Arrow" mod is usually one of the first mods to appear.

PS. Not to say that Bethesda will be literally BURIED under the amount of complains from users, who would want to report a bug that "a particular person/creature/etc." doesn't exist at a quest location or disappears or smth.

From the developer point of view, it will be a waste of time and nerves to remove the green arrow.

I would rather have them tell us the general location as opposed to the exact location of something.
Also, if we are looking for an item in a cave for example, i would prefer it if they tell you it is in the cave but do not lead you to it. That way you have to explore the cave instead of taking the direct route to the exact location of the item like in oblivion.

I`d be just fine.

I always explore a cave completely even when I know where the goal is. This is standard RPG 101, you know?

Green markers are important because the game isn't good enough to work without it. As an example, if you need to find someone in a big city, and that person is always moving around at different times of the day, it would be ridiculous to find that person in a reasonable time without an online guide.

I don't LIKE getting lost. It's a waste of my time, and it is not fun. Especially since there is usually nothing to show for it to make a wrong turn and lose two hours in real life. I expect my player character to have basic orienteering skills and can understand directions.

yesh

To be honest, after learning how to use them in Oblivion I really don't want them to be unavoidably applied to EVERY quest in the game. The fact is, if people can't work out how to play the game, then they aren't going to enjoy playing the game. The quest markers take away all the enjoyment for me, because the vanilla game quests become a boring and repetitive errand run with the compass marker in the corner of my eye guiding me to where I need to go. Then you play it without and the lack of information and attention to detail in the directions received from the NPC makes the quests much less interesting than Morrowind was. In the vanilla game, I would say offhand that the MQ, the Dark Brotherhood and the daedra shrines got the most attention from the developers, because these quests are the easiest for you to work out what to do.

I feel that all the quest markers really add to the game is to take away the challenge of problem solving from the player and then prevent them from needing to refer to a walk-through.

On the other hand, quest markers are a really useful way of keeping track of moving NPCs. When I tried to lure Havilstein Hoar-Blood to Dive Rock with a combo of fast travel and a 3-second command humanoid, the quest marker prevented me from needing to spend hours searching for him again.

Maybe once you have seen an NPC, the quest marker pops up? Or the quest maker marks all the public places that the NPC makes their way to?

This has been discussed recently.
While i despise the quest markers concept, i have come to realzie how the Radiant Story poses a challenge to its complete absence. If some quest objective locations are variable, are they going to record dialogue for each one of them?

Don't think so.

So perhaps quest markers are a necessary evil. I'd still like them to come up with a system where they're deemed obsolte.

A toggle would be nice. Pleases both sides.

I'd prefer no markers that pointed you to the nearest blade of grass. I'd prefer being given directions from NPC's to the general area.Obviously how much they like you or know about the place etc will come into play here. And i'm sure i read somewhere we can now place our own markers. Placing our own markers and general directions from NPC's is far better,than a green marker saying follow me,this is where we go. It's good to get lost or get distracted sometimes,it adds to the adventure of you character.

But yeah,overall i prefer no markers ( unless we can place our own with a rough idea ). I prefer directions from NPC's. Though,if there are options for both types of players ( which seems to be the case with fast travel now ) no-one need complain.

What's this obsession about wanting to be lost?

Am I the only person around here who is against having fake difficulty in the form of hiding things in obscure places and force me to waste hours of my time running around in circles?

If I am lost, I am NOT having fun. Because I wouldn't be playing anything. Being lost is not the same as exploration.

People who want to be lost should just play the game with a blindfold. Then you can enjoy being lost forever.

So you get zero sense of achievement from finding something?

The game would be designed poorly if the player was running round in circles all the time (Dwemer puzzle box anyone?). That doesn't excuse the game from splashing a bright red arrow on the compass to point exactly where you need to go.

Why, that's part of the fun!
Don't take this the wrong way, but a different genre might suit you better.
Anyways, i think it's confirmed markers are in. GPS for you.

Never had any trouble with the Dwemer Puzzle Box. :shrug:

As for the option of turning it on or off, we already have that option. It is not perfect but we can put on another quest. This way the quest you want will not be highlighted but another one is. Thing is, it is still annoying to see the red or green arrows, so it is not a perfect solution.

Sometimes I am an idiot and would like to have an "indicator" where to roughly go. I found out after playing Oblvion and then other games that don't do this, I am more stupider when playing games because I am use to having my hand held.

I would like the option be toggled. Have it off when I don't want it, and when I am stuck turn it on.

At first when I had played Oblivion quite alot I thought I'd want it, since it made me lazy. I recently reinstalled Morrowind, and honestly, I hope there won't be quest markers, or at least an options to play without. It really does add to the game to have to look through your journal and ask NPCs for directions, and think for yourself once in a while, rather than have everything handed to you on a plate.

Would I be okay without them?

No. They appeal to the lazy in me.

Make it toggable and please everyone. Or is that too easy?

And what genre might that be?
If you want me to not take it the wrong way, you better explain what genre would suit me.

I don't enjoy being lost in any type of game. It is a sign of bad game design.

I think this needs a major overhaul, and many have already separately pointed out great options besides a toggle.

Some NPCs/Notes etc. should be able to give you exact directions, and some should be more general. For the exact, a marker on the map, for general, some form of highlighting on the map for the path to take from a well known landmark. Nothing should appear on the magic HUD compass for this, only in the map menu. These markers would only be for locations, and not for the specific NPCs and objectives of said quest. Your quest log notes could also contain directions you were given for the general that you can read.

For non-combat/crime target NPCs of quests, an arrow can appear even on the compass when you are within close proximity to your target. This may not be "immersive" enough for folks, but the problem is, you can't ask other NPCs where said person is, so all you can do is blindly and stupidly walk up to each NPC and check their name on the HUD or speak to them for no reason, which also is problematic for enjoyment and RP at the same time.

How good directions did those games give?

Quest journals / NPCs in Skyrim would have to be alot better than the ones in Oblivion, for the quest markers to go away. (Now, I could see a compromise - markers to the general location, like the entrance of a cave, but not to the exact target in the cave.)



....thinking about it, there are other places where you'd need some kind of improvement over Oblivion, if you wanted to get rid of markers. "Go talk to ______", for example. That's fine when the NPCs in your game just stand in one place. But when it's someone whose daily schedule takes them all over the Imperial City at various times, it's a bit more tedious.

Options are good. In FNV I was able to complete most of the quest without the markers because there were proper directions given. Beth had the right idea with OB, but just like scaling and fast travel there implementation was off. Many newer games from Mario to LA Noire are including level bypass options for players who get stuck. This is how quest markers should work. If you can't find were you need to go, you check your map and turn on the quest marker. This is much better than spending an hour in frustration then checking a wiki.

And again for those who want quest markers gone with entirely, why are you being so mindlessly selfish? Do you not want others to enjoy the game? More options for all types of players are good(this includes those you want good directions also), it sells more games and allows Beth to afford 100 person teams to make awesome games.

Anyone recall how if FO3 quest could generally be completed with out the markers?

I hate quest markers. I hope they get rid of them, and give me some proper directions and descriptions instead.

I like quest markers and if I don't want to look at my map, I won't. As for the compass, if I don't want to see my display, there's a setting in Fallout New Vegas to make it disappear. If it's like that for Skyrim, it would be great so different players can have it their own way.

:tes: