[WIP] Wrye Bash Pictorial Guide for Newbies

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:19 am

Now at Version 7.9

http://tesalliance.org/forums/index.php?/files/file/669-wrye-bash-pictorial-guide/

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=35230

Edit: Any pick-ups by the eagle eyed Wrye bash ninjas among us gratefully appreciated. Trying to keep it condensed, and not over-bearing with enough information just to get the fledgelings off the ground and go "O_o... Now I get it!" :twirl:

From the Decsription.........

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just to get you started with Wrye bash
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

After installing http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=22368 I recommend installing http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=20516 - Wrye Bash and BOSS together are essentials.

Download the pdf files to view off-line at the same time as using Wrye Bash, and flip between the two - Requires a pdf reader, an open source variety here http://blog.kowalczyk.info/software/sumatrapdf/free-pdf-reader.html - does what you need a PDF reader to do.


Wrye Bash Pictorial Guide - Basics and Intro to Installers - Basics to get you up and running with Wrye Bash - The Intro to Installers section of this guide details using previously made Bain Friendly/Ready Installers

Wrye Bash Pictorial Guide - Installers Advanced pdf - For a more in-depth look at BAINs

Wrye Bash Pictorial Guide - Installers Creation pdf - A little more advanced; Make your own BAINs
Installers Creation also requires the Wrye Bash INI Tweaks for DarkUI DarN Bain creation.

Wrye Bash INI Tweaks Xtras file are just INI Edits not included with Wrye Bash which you may find useful occasionally. Its also a simple BAIN, so to install them just throw this file in Bash Installers - Simples.

Wrye Bash Pictorial Guide Complete - This file contains All images in jpg format from all pdf's; For those who may prefer to browse the guide using Windows Picture and Fax Viewer.


If you dont have 7zip for creating BAINs ... http://www.7-zip.org/

Also heres a few very helpfull links ...

First - If you are new to modding Oblivion - http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/449239-oblivion-mods-faq/ - A bit out of date now, for instance BSA Redirection is now the recommended archive invalidation method (and by default used by Wrye Bash and OBMM), and the advice reference where to install your game if using Windows Vista also applies to Windows 7 - Modding Oblivion is never going to be as easy as a one-click solution, you need to understand what you are doing. A bit of understanding http://www.tweakguides.com/TGTC.html might help too (Just grab the regular download).

Tomlongs guide (along with many more topics accessed by the Main menu) to...
http://tesivpositive.animolious.com/?page=installing_mods and http://tesivpositive.animolious.com/?page=bain_installation

And Psymons guide and detailed instructions on ...
http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1084204-bain-mod-installation-projects/

Hopefully, this will help some of you to get past the initial information overload barrier that is the Wrye Bash.html help file, and get on with modding/playing a far more stable game setup .... Chow for now :)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Links to ready made BAIN's you can use out of the box

Heres a short list of links I know of and have used (I am obviously not going to go scouring the whole of Nexus for you), where modders have created an additional BAIN ready/friendly archive (or they are already simple BAIN's bcause the author packed them that way) you can just drop in your Bash Installers folder and install with Wrye Bash.

These may also help you to get your head around creating your own - The method I used to get to know them was to download a few and just pull them apart in a working folder, and refer to the Wrye Bash Help File, and lastly but most importantly, the Mod creators instructions, in detail, so you know exactly where files are supposed to end up (also the method Psymon took to begin learning them)

The following by Wrye himself, a bit old now (and I dont use these myself) they work but are better used now as examples to get you started creating BAINs, some simple, some complex....
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=22170 - I still use the Streamline one, but included the patch into just one streamline BAIN. Darnified UI can be used, I preferred making a new one out of DarkUI Darn (and a bash ini tweak file for setting the custom fonts settings conveniently from bash)

Simple BAIN examples

First this little set should be an essential part of anyones installation, and installed in the following order....
1. http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=5296 - No other files required, the manual version includes the updates, just drop this in Bash Installers\ folder - This can be adapted slightly, though not necessary - see my Installers Creation PDF for details.
2. For those with Shivering Isles installed - If not skip this one - http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=10739 - Again the Manual Version is the file you want, drop in Bash Installers\
3. For those with any DLCs (or the GOTY version of Oblivion) http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9969 - Manual version, BUT when installing as a Bain, in the ESP filter box uncheck any DLCs you do not have installed ... or - This could quite easily be converted into a complex BAIN, taking the esp's out of the data folder, place them in their own individual sub-packages for selection on installing similar to....
4. http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=27710 - Complex BAIN this one, up to date and maintained by Arthmoor, correcting previously un-discovered problems with 1 & 3 above (and requires those to be installed first for this to overwrite corrected files).

A simple Bain which is a marvellous addition to anyones installation, and will not make a difference to performance of your machine .....
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=18430
Even using with vanilla textures the difference is remarkable (Check the user uploaded images, I placed a couple there for comparison - Not even using Large texture setting in-game, just medium).

Brittainy's http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=37336#fileanchor - In the Main files Brittainy has included a complex BAIN, which includes all the other optional files. Version 1.3 now includes a Wizard installer.

Phitt's new Sneak Penalties, drop it in Bash Installers folder, install via Wrye Bash ... easy http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=35792
Once installed it has an ini file which can be tweaked to customise your experience.

Saebel's Sneaking Detection Recalibrated - A new alternate choice to Phitt's Sneak Penalties (choose either one or the other - They conflict, so only run one of them); As with Phitt's, grab the zip version and drop it in Bash Installers folder, and again once installed it has an ini file which can be tweaked to customize it. http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=37385.
If you are wondering what this does differently to Phitt's, check out the http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1170938-relz-new-mod-sneaking-detection-recalibrated/ in particular http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1170938-relz-new-mod-sneaking-detection-recalibrated/page__view__findpost__p__17276820

Pretty much anything by Arthmoor, a few of his are complex http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=20218 for example....

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=35265

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=21562

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=30000

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=33462

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=26643

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=37655#fileanchor

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=31773

And to compliment that last one, Khettienna's files for a few additional refinements to life in the Dark Brotherhood ;) - Though they fall into the Complex category .....

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=22135

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=25319

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=18054

And to compliment Better Benirus Manor http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=23146

Display Stats by TheNiceOne, Complex BAIN, and OMOD ready (the OMOD data in this will be ignored by Wrye Bash)...
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=31855

Also by TheNiceOne http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=35393 - The one file here is already BAIN Ready to drop in installers folder.

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=35333 - Originally by SirFrederik, Andalaybay has taken over development - its a levelling system replacement, the new main file is now a BAIN/OMOD ready Complex installer.

AMB - All Male Bodies by room207, will fit your Roberts Male requirements with a lot of options. Room207 has Given Malonn permission to put the mod together in a BAIN and Malonn is hosting the file - Search TESNexus for "BAIN Wizard Installation Project"

The Eyecandy Variants Expansion (EVE) HGEC Body Selector and Stock Equipment Replacer
Cannot link due to advlt content - Search on tesnexus for - EVE HGEC Eyecandy Variants
Also Malonn again has created a Wizard for this one - Search TESNexus for "BAIN Wizard Installation Project"

TGND Female body by Luchaire and Kalia (BAIN by yours truly) - An alternative female body mesh set (with Stock Clothing and Armour, and a selection of popular armours made for this body) - Still requires an Exnem or HGEC compatible body texture (EVE above, Ozmo's or F-Inev for instance)
Search TESNexus for TGND

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=36177 - Complex installer.

Emma's http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=28977 - The main file, and patch file required are Simple Bains' (when installing make sure the newer version overwrites the esp of the older by arranging your install order appropriately).
If also you want to customize Vilja - In the optional files there the Vilja Customisation Pack is a complex installer, select sub package required (if using XTudo or 4VGN Custom Vilja, dont forget the teeth sub-package), and also ensure you have the race specific files required for some of these from the original author.

Emma's http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=37842 - Simple BAIN; House and Quest mod from a very talented author and will more than likely be the most accommodating house mod for companions we have ever seen. Beautiful work.

AWLS meshes, and Brumbeks mixed textures files are both BAINs (See further note below)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19628

All Natural by Chong Li, Arthmoor, Brumbek, & WrinklyNinja
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=18305
Though not immediately obvious, is also a complex BAIN
(Some additional configuration post installation may be needed in the installed .ini file - Read the manual)

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=35856
This one only does a tiny thing - But its so nice, fed up of the in-game mouse cursor? - Lots to choose from, Complex BAIN, wizard installation with screenshots (see note below on wizards).

Elven Map Compilation 1
The in-game world map here has a lot of choices - Recently a new file has been added (go to the bottom of the files listed in Optional Files) Which is another complex BAIN and OMOD ready
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=31273

Arthmoors RAEVWD, and RAEVWD SI Edition
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=20053 - Both of the main files now include a wizard which Malonn put together for easier scripted installation.

One further note; Brittainy's Lush and Gaudy textures, Malonn's AMB BAIN, EVE (link for the additional Wizard also by Malonn), AWLS, All Natural, Cursor Mod, Elven Map Compilation, RAEVWD and RAEVWD SI Edition, are pretty unique at the moment - They use a new feature of Wrye bash called Installer Wizards. If you right click the Installer, before you install, choose Wizard instead. This will guide you through choices to make in the sub-packages (just like an OBMM script), typically things like "Do you use QTP3?" if not the wizard will ensure you dont select any of the related sub-packages... It selects all sub-packages appropriately for you. Then you just right click the installer and choose Install... simples ;)

If you select 'Auto-Anneal/Install Wizards' in the main Installers menu, it will automatically install upon wizard completion.

If an Installer does not have a Wizard, the option will be ghosted un-available.

New; - Malonn has started a page for BAIN Wizards for mods that do not have them - - Search TESNexus for "BAIN Wizard Installation Project" (Can no longer link, advlt content with AMB mod) - more to follow.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Updates recently

Update 24th Jan 2011 - All guides now Colour Blind friendly, using http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9518668ColourBlindFriendlyPalette.jpg and checked using http://vischeck.com/vischeck/vischeckImage.php passed a load of the images through from different guides in Deuteranope and Tritanope filters happy to say they seem to be fine, I believe also the contrasting adjacent colours chosen should also be okay (or as good as they can be) for Monochromatic vision which is the worst of cases to compensate for. Reference for anyone who wants to research similar for their own use http://jfly.iam.u-tokyo.ac.jp/color/

Minor Update 24th Feb 2011 - Installers Advanced PDF; Updated screen 2, note added on naming conventions of BAIN sub-packages - Also additional screen 15 reference installing OBSE plugins.

Minor Update 25th Feb 2011 - Installers Advanced PDF; Updated screen 2, note added on naming conventions of BAIN sub-packages - Reason for update?, I got one word wrong :blush: Where it said 'numerically named win' should have read 'alphabetically named win'

New updated file 28th Feb 2011 - Wrye Bash INI Tweaks Xtras - Just a few more ini tweaks added, if you have ever wanted to change the game settings for textures Large, Medium, Small without going into the game and then having to restart ... For instance you have installed new textures via Wrye Bash BAIN and want to go straight into the game with Medium Textures setting - You now have an ini tweak to set it via Wrye Bash before you launch the game.....
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9418175initweaks-install.jpg
http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5171616initweaks-use.jpg

New updated file 9th Mar 2011 - Wrye Bash INI Tweaks Xtras - Just one more ini tweak added, Grass MaxGrassTypesPerTexture 6 - For use with mods such as Diverse Grasses
User avatar
Rebecca Clare Smith
 
Posts: 3508
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 4:13 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:53 am

Would you consider packing these up into a pdf? I think it would be easier for people to download a file, even if they don't want to print it...

Yes thats a better idea, I was first waiting until I got past my baby steps creating the thing on nexus and when all suggestions for change fade away. Then just going to bundle them up in a zip for download so that people dont have to have browser open, just windows Picture and fax viewer which they can pop to front whilst using Wrye bash instead of having to have their browser open, allowing portability. I also considered a powerpoint, but pdf is a better way to go - Thank you.

Concerning the Mark Mergeables, I can't say if the auto is buggy or not although I never use Mark Mergeables, and when I have tested I saw now difference.
Regardless, I don't think there is any harm in instructing people to use it, but if it is/was buggy, I don't think it has been fixed so you should just stick to what you had originally.
Don't even bother confusing people with mention that bash is capable of doing it automatically
.

Aagh :), reverting to previous version - Done ;)

Re: the BAIN section.. just being honest here trying to offer constructive criticism. I found it to be pretty confusing.
I think you have tried to address too much with this.
I would suggest a BAIN primer that only addresses how to manage pre-made bain-ready archives, then address how to make your own.
You have sort of mixed the two together.
In Progress - And considering similar Surazal's suggestion below - Done

About install and load ordering:
I think it is important to mention that re-ordering by drag-n-drop only works if the mod or installers list is sorted by Order. Done ;)

This is a matter of preference really, but contrary to common practice, I beleive it makes the most sense if the installers and mods are sorted in descending order.
I think this is a better representation of how the mods affect eachother and corresponds to the concept of 'being higher in the install/load order'.

This means in the mods tab, the bashed patch is on top and the esm's are at the bottom.
Similarly for the installers. An added benefit is that all inactive installers are at the bottom of the list below the ==Last== marker.
Unfortunately, there is alot of documentation and discussion already that assumes the lists are sorted in ascending order, so use your own judgement I guess
. Solved this, removed higher lower labels, user can decide which way up to go about it utilizing conflicts report ;)

I would also recommend not to enable either of the sort options in the r-click menu. Using them will mean that the list is not sorted by install order. Done ;)

All good stuff, after reviewing it myself after a nights sleep there are already a few bits I cringed at myself this morning :), it is a bit confussed. I think I will leave it a week, see if there are any more constructive (or opposing) comments then refine it when I have more time next week (might open up the comments for a short while to get a feel from users aspect) - I think I have been using it too long to look at it from a newbs point of view - Also I need to get mention of Annealing in there, and Full refresh so will probably add a few more pics and flesh it out/less compact for easier flow.
User avatar
Dona BlackHeart
 
Posts: 3405
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2006 4:05 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:26 am

Thanks for taking the time to do this - I think it will be of great help to many people.

May I suggest that you create three PDF or HTML files - 1. Creating bashed patches, 2. Starters guide to simple BAIN packages and 3. Advanced BAIN for complex packages. I think this will be easier for users to take small steps and easier for you to maintain and refine.

Hope this helps

PS Might be an idea to start a topic in this forum :)
Done

Thank you, will look at splitting up as suggested

Edit: Oh and ... "Tada!", new topic
User avatar
Damien Mulvenna
 
Posts: 3498
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:33 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:01 am

And if you want you can use anything from my thread. If you want.

If made I know I will link it on my thread.


And thank you too, thought about asking instead of re-inventing the wheel last night but got too late :)
User avatar
Liii BLATES
 
Posts: 3423
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 10:41 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:44 am

Unfortunately I can't see the pictures on Nexus, so I can't comment much on their content - hence the request for a pdf :) I wanted to go through the pics for the BAIN installation since that's the piece that I haven't done yet. Even after clicking on the images, they were too fuzzy and if I expanded them more, I couldn't read your callouts. So I'll probably have to wait for the pdf version and give my comments then...

Edit: Just looked at a couple and they look pretty good, so I'm not sure which ones I was looking at that I had problems with... Will wait for the pdf anyway - too awkward to try to go through them on screen :)
User avatar
josie treuberg
 
Posts: 3572
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2007 7:56 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:36 pm

Approximately around the time you posted I was taking them all down and re-uploading (you have to feed them up one at a time, and in reverse order, the last one you upload is the first picture in the images.... so if you want to change say the tenth one, you have to delete 1 through 10, then re-upload them starting with 10, 9, 8 ...etc)

A bit of a fiddly long winded process (and making a mistake is a pain), but getting quicker, now figured using the ctrl and mouse scroll I can resize everything in the browser window, then duplicate multiple tabs with the upload buttons ready, get them all in sequence, then go through the multiple tabs in sequence hitting upload.

Anyway, no more messing tonight, correction applied to Basics pic reference Mark mergeable, new Installers section, to be followed by Creating Installers sections Simple then Complex (and eventually when happy the final pdf's - going to have to do that via redirecting a doc through a postscript driver method, I dont have Adobe reader bloatware installed and certainly would not pay them for the privilege). I am dual booting linux too so when I get to that stage I am sure there will be a few ways to skin that cat.
User avatar
Reven Lord
 
Posts: 3452
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 9:56 pm

Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:02 pm

Thanks. I`m looking forward to the PDF version!
User avatar
Marilú
 
Posts: 3449
Joined: Sat Oct 07, 2006 7:17 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:26 am

Approximately around the time you posted I was taking them all down and re-uploading (you have to feed them up one at a time, and in reverse order, the last one you upload is the first picture in the images.... so if you want to change say the tenth one, you have to delete 1 through 10, then re-upload them starting with 10, 9, 8 ...etc)

A bit of a fiddly long winded process (and making a mistake is a pain), but getting quicker, now figured using the ctrl and mouse scroll I can resize everything in the browser window, then duplicate multiple tabs with the upload buttons ready, get them all in sequence, then go through the multiple tabs in sequence hitting upload.

Anyway, no more messing tonight, correction applied to Basics pic reference Mark mergeable, new Installers section, to be followed by Creating Installers sections Simple then Complex (and eventually when happy the final pdf's - going to have to do that via redirecting a doc through a postscript driver method, I dont have Adobe reader bloatware installed and certainly would not pay them for the privilege). I am dual booting linux too so when I get to that stage I am sure there will be a few ways to skin that cat.


I was wondering if you had the software to create pdf's. Another option might be to grab http://www.openoffice.org/. I use it professionally (ie my job requires me to write a lot of documentation) and prefer it over Word because it handles images better (they stay were you put them). You could just insert all the images into a document, export to pdf and voila, you're done! OpenOffice is free, but is developed by Sun/Oracle - if you haven't heard of them, well, have a look at their stock prices :)
User avatar
alicia hillier
 
Posts: 3387
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2007 2:57 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:32 am

I was wondering if you had the software to create pdf's. Another option might be to grab http://www.openoffice.org/. I use it professionally (ie my job requires me to write a lot of documentation) and prefer it over Word because it handles images better (they stay were you put them). You could just insert all the images into a document, export to pdf and voila, you're done! OpenOffice is free, but is developed by Sun/Oracle - if you haven't heard of them, well, have a look at their stock prices :)


:blush: I have OOo installed, for those in-frequent moments I need to view something created by microsoft office, I didn't know it had an export pdf. So thats not going to be as convoluted as I thought... thanks for the hint.
User avatar
Stat Wrecker
 
Posts: 3511
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 6:14 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:23 am

:blush: I have OOo installed, for those in-frequent moments I need to view something created by microsoft office, I didn't know it had an export pdf. So thats not going to be as convoluted as I thought... thanks for the hint.


Ok, no more excuses then! ;) The export option is in the File menu. Glad I could help :)

Edit: just teasing, btw. Not sure how the tone came across...
User avatar
jasminε
 
Posts: 3511
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 4:12 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:43 am

Ok, no more excuses then! ;) The export option is in the File menu. Glad I could help :)

Edit: just teasing, btw. Not sure how the tone came across...


Your netiquette is fine sir :) - Just loaded linux up and (after a fair few updates... its obviously been a while) had a play with OOo

http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1193364Screenshot.jpg Export to pdf has been staring me in the face every time I have been to the file menu :facepalm:

Anyway, after a bit of meddling, theres a mark 1 version of the pdf up on nexus now. Its a bit rough around the edges for a first try but has all pics currently in the images.
User avatar
cosmo valerga
 
Posts: 3477
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:21 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:55 am

Your netiquette is fine sir :) - Just loaded linux up and (after a fair few updates... its obviously been a while) had a play with OOo

http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1193364Screenshot.jpg Export to pdf has been staring me in the face every time I have been to the file menu :facepalm:

Anyway, after a bit of meddling, theres a mark 1 version of the pdf up on nexus now. Its a bit rough around the edges for a first try but has all pics currently in the images.


Well good, and that would be ma'am. Mind you, though, anyone who calls me "ma'am" to my face gets a scowl at least :) So maybe I shouldn't complain too much ;) I'll grab the pdf and have a look.

Thanks for this, btw. I must admit I get so tired of reading installation instructions that seem to go on forever - this will be a nice change!
User avatar
Connie Thomas
 
Posts: 3362
Joined: Sun Nov 19, 2006 9:58 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:44 am

looking good, it makes more sense now :)
User avatar
Sherry Speakman
 
Posts: 3487
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:00 pm

Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 11:53 pm

This refers to the pdf version of your guide:

Ok, just had a look at the BAIN installation part... and I have no idea what you're trying to describe! I tried one BAIN installation and it failed miserably, so I am probably the perfect candidate to review this part, if you want a newbie to look at it for you :) I'm pretty comfortable with other aspects of WB, but I've never figured out BAIN. I normally use OBMM. I make OMOD's of everything and can even edit OBMM scripts and repackage mods etc.

First slide, no problem, good start. Second slide, I think you meant to indicate what I'm supposed to select? I understand installation order, but still found your comment a little obscure or awkward. Perhaps you could rephrase point #1 to something like this: The installation order can be rearranged by dragging and dropping the archive files with the mouse. The installers should be sorted by Order. You can do this by clicking on the Order heading (I'm guessing that's how you would sort by order). Also rather than Note well... I would rephrase this as "Take note of the following..." or something. I didn't understand Note well... the first time I read it.

Third slide - good. No problems there :) But I think the third slide should go in the second slot!

I found the fourth slide awkward. I would prefer your comments here to be in a bubble or something. When I first looked at the slide, I wasn't sure what you were trying to say. Basically the text in the comments section looks like it's part of the screen and doesn't stand out enough. I admit that I don't have WB open while reading this, but knowing how WB works, I would prefer to at least scan through your guide before opening WB and trying it.

Fifth slide: I would just say right-click on the archive and select Install. In fact, unless there is a reason not to, I would say right-click on the installers tab and choose Anneal All. Then right-click on the archive and select Install.

Bit of grammar, if I may: "want to be sure their is nothing un-resolved..." should be "want to be sure there is nothing unresolved...".

So, I think I could do a simple BAIN install now. :) Are you going to explain how to repackage mods for BAIN or how to deal with more complicated installs? I think the picture route is definitely the way to go. If you want a hand writing any of this, just pm me. I do it for a living ;)
User avatar
Alexis Acevedo
 
Posts: 3330
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:58 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:47 am

Good points and oopsy on the Sir :), just awoke and off to work but will amend and re-upload MarkII later, and yes creating installers section for simple and complex to come. Thank you
User avatar
Chris Cross Cabaret Man
 
Posts: 3301
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2007 11:33 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:48 pm

I don't know how much effort you want to put into this, but if I'm not imposing...

1. All your images should follow along as if you are the reader. Since most readers will be first-time users of Wrye Bash, this means you should have no installers in your Wrye Bash images, except those involved with the tutorial.

2. Center the tutorial around taking the reader through the installation of a specific set of mods.
Starting with...
i. A Simple BAIN-friendly archive.
ii. A Complex BAIN-ready archive.
iii. An incompatible archive that requires repackaging.

3. Do not explain anything they don't need to know until it's pertinent to them.
EG. For the simple archive, it will be their first mod that is installed, so there is nothing to sort or check for conflicts, no sub-packages to be aware of, etc.

4. Here is a brief rundown of the basic steps and the order I feel should be covered.
a. simple bain installation for UOP and UOPS
b. explain about conflicts and install order.
c. build bashed patch
d. BOSS the load order
e. install complex archive
f. check for conflicts and sort install order
g. (optional bashed and BOSS again)
h. repackaging an unrecognized archive
i. check for conflicts and sort install order
j. bashed and BOSS again

UOP and UOPS are good choices to demonstrate the simple archives and conflict resolution.
For the other mods, I'm not sure. Ideally some mods that most people would want anyways.
For complex, possibly Cobl.
For repackaging, maybe show how to incorporate a mod with an additional patch that was downloaded so they can be installed at once.
User avatar
El Khatiri
 
Posts: 3568
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 2:43 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:20 am

Very useful. Thanks.
User avatar
u gone see
 
Posts: 3388
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 2:53 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:08 am

I don't know how much effort you want to put into this, but if I'm not imposing...

1. All your images should follow along as if you are the reader. Since most readers will be first-time users of Wrye Bash, this means you should have no installers in your Wrye Bash images, except those involved with the tutorial.

2. Center the tutorial around taking the reader through the installation of a specific set of mods.
Starting with...
i. A Simple BAIN-friendly archive.
ii. A Complex BAIN-ready archive.
iii. An incompatible archive that requires repackaging.

3. Do not explain anything they don't need to know until it's pertinent to them.
EG. For the simple archive, it will be their first mod that is installed, so there is nothing to sort or check for conflicts, no sub-packages to be aware of, etc.

4. Here is a brief rundown of the basic steps and the order I feel should be covered.
a. simple bain installation for UOP and UOPS
b. explain about conflicts and install order.
c. build bashed patch
d. BOSS the load order
e. install complex archive
f. check for conflicts and sort install order
g. (optional bashed and BOSS again)
h. repackaging an unrecognized archive
i. check for conflicts and sort install order
j. bashed and BOSS again

UOP and UOPS are good choices to demonstrate the simple archives and conflict resolution.
For the other mods, I'm not sure. Ideally some mods that most people would want anyways.
For complex, possibly Cobl.
For repackaging, maybe show how to incorporate a mod with an additional patch that was downloaded so they can be installed at once.


I second most of these suggestions :) Especially the ones about showing the installer list. It was overwhelming and rather hard to read. Since I'm not completely new to mods, I wasn't too upset, but it does make the tutorial a little harder to follow. I also agree with not discussing stuff you don't need yet. I think you found this as well because in a later slide you had to refer back to a previous one. Perhaps if you just left out the details about sorting your installation order in the earlier slide, then you could just give the details in the later one when it was pertinent.

I agree with using the UOP as a mod sample, but with the number of conflicts that you are going to have with it, I'm not sure I would call it simple. On the other hand, the UOP should be loaded early, so I guess it's complexity would kick in later when you are loading mods that would override the UOP and its variants. Then, I'd pick something with just a readme, an ESP and a BSA or just a few files in the Meshes and Textures folders. I wouldn't suggest something too simple - that'd be a waste of time. But perhaps this second pick should have some conflicts with the UOP so you can demonstrate how those are handled.

Some food for thought - like you needed any more :)
User avatar
Mr.Broom30
 
Posts: 3433
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:05 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:14 am

Thanks Alt3rn1ty, your tutorial is going to be extremely useful..

For one, I've learnt about the Mod Checker button (never seen that mentioned before lol!)

Regarding settings, would you suggest to keep autoghosting on or off?

Cheers :)
User avatar
loste juliana
 
Posts: 3417
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 7:37 pm

Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:04 pm

Noted all above, more progress being made, but not sure if I will get another one up tonight. The biggest reason for that is the following....

I found the fourth slide awkward. I would prefer your comments here to be in a bubble or something.

So its all Andalaybay's fault :)
Just joking, actually I should have done this earlier, it has crossed my mind a few times but plowed on with additions instead - And that is to be consistent in presenting what is a comment from me, and contrast with the rest of the picture I am no graphic/presentation artist so theres been a bit of a learning curve here.... but some basics like colour coding for better appreciation I do know. And so... tonight I took a step backwards and re-did a lot of what has already been done.

Regarding settings, would you suggest to keep autoghosting on or off?


No clue, never used it, but trust me you are in good hands :D. Personally I dont like the idea, I read what it did and thought thats just going to confuse the hell out of me sometime in the future so never enabled it. Someone else might pop along and extoll its virtues but at the moment I'm not the best mere mortal to suggest either way really. Might look into it again at a later date myself, but its quite a new feature in the history of Wrye's tools.

@ Gaticus - You have an abundance of great suggestions, how much I intend to do... unsure at the moment, and depends if I anticipate being called away from home RL I might just have to wrap earlier than I would like. Initial sketchy idea was for 20 odd pictures to get a newb smiling and interested enough to venture into more detail in the help file or links thereafter - If I'm honest the expansion of ideas I would love to implement all, its looking like it is going to be really appreciated by many. I still want to have a plow through the reams of tomes by Psymon for possible snippets to include too.

At the moment though, I am just plodding on with elements from the first couple of suggestions I still haven't got round to (and getting used to software I have never used extensively before to bring it together). If I get fed up with it I will just say "right, enough, end, thats the lot, its done, cant be doing with it any more" :)

Before that happens though... Be Warned people, O_o, I am taking names, when the revolution comes those names will be up against the wall... In the credits :D

(Oh crap!, I think I just set myself up for a torrent of suggestions..... RUN AWAY!!!! :bolt: )
User avatar
Myles
 
Posts: 3341
Joined: Sun Oct 21, 2007 12:52 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:00 pm

Noted all above, more progress being made, but not sure if I will get another one up tonight. The biggest reason for that is the following....
So its all Andalaybay's fault :)


That's ok, it's always my fault :)

At the moment though, I am just plodding on with elements from the first couple of suggestions I still haven't got round to (and getting used to software I have never used extensively before to bring it together). If I get fed up with it I will just say "right, enough, end, thats the lot, its done, cant be doing with it any more" :)

Before that happens though... Be Warned people, O_o, I am taking names, when the revolution comes those names will be up against the wall... In the credits :D

(Oh crap!, I think I just set myself up for a torrent of suggestions..... RUN AWAY!!!! :bolt: )


I agree. I can see this getting completely out of hand. I was a bit hesitant to make extensive suggestions myself, but Gaticus had some good ones, so I decided to second them :) If you would like some screenshots of an empty Installers tab or one with just one or two mods, maybe I can do that for you...

Another comment, if I may: I had a look at the earlier slides because I wanted to check if you have to deactivate a mod before doing imports and that wasn't clear. Perhaps you could clarify that? I don't think it matters for imports, but I had some problems at one point and it was because I actually needed to deactivate them first. I'm pretty sure it was imports that I was trying to do and not merges - I don't have anything merged.
User avatar
mishionary
 
Posts: 3414
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:19 am

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:06 am

I wanted to check if you have to deactivate a mod before doing imports and that wasn't clear. Perhaps you could clarify that? I don't think it matters for imports, but I had some problems at one point and it was because I actually needed to deactivate them first. I'm pretty sure it was imports that I was trying to do and not merges - I don't have anything merged.


Sorry if I hijack the thread a bit, but could you please clarify that?

You mean the correct procedure is

1. install mod via BAIN
2. leave esp unchecked
3. run Boss
4. rebuild Patch and mark mod-related import settings
5. check .esp (unless it's a filter)
6. click Mod Checker and follow its suggestions (if any)
7. close WB

Right or am I missing something?

Thanks :)
User avatar
CArla HOlbert
 
Posts: 3342
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 11:35 pm

Post » Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:06 pm

Double post
User avatar
Britney Lopez
 
Posts: 3469
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:22 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:44 am

Sorry if I hijack the thread a bit, but could you please clarify that?

You mean the correct procedure is

1. install mod via BAIN
2. leave esp unchecked
3. run Boss
4. rebuild Patch and mark mod-related import settings
5. check .esp (unless it's a filter)
6. click Mod Checker and follow its suggestions (if any)
7. close WB

Right or am I missing something?

Thanks :)


No, I wasn't referring to the installation part. In the first part of his guide Alt3rn1ty talks about regular Wrye Bash functions. In particular he was explaining how to build a Bash Patch. I was asking for clarification on the Import options when you are (re)-building your Bash Patch.

After installing your mod, you would leave it activated (checked) and run BOSS. I'm not sure if it should be activated or not when you are building the Patch. It might depend on whether you are importing the mod in its entirety or not. I think that might be what's going on. If the mod only has graphics replacers, then you can import those changes into your Bash Patch and you don't need to have the plugin activated. If the plugin has other stuff it does as well, then you might want to import it, but it would have to remain activated. I think in these cases, you need to rely on BOSS setting the WB tags for you.

Other than the inactivation at the start, I think you have the procedure down.
User avatar
Leonie Connor
 
Posts: 3434
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 4:18 pm

Post » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:23 am

Merged plugins must be deactivated, but Bash will tell you this when you try to rebuild the patch.
Imports do not need to be deactivated, because you are only merging a portion of the plugin. Some of the plugin is still in use.
User avatar
Alexandra walker
 
Posts: 3441
Joined: Wed Sep 13, 2006 2:50 am

Next

Return to IV - Oblivion