[Jessica Nash]

I also have this problem. The load order is not based on timestamps. BOSS correctly set the timestamps, and WB can show the correct timestomp, but load orders are incorrect.

...

I can't replicate this bug. Can you provide me with some steps to take so that I might consistently experience it? I.e. starting from when the timestamps are automatically changed to fit the wrong order (so when the load order displayed and the timestamps are in sync), what do you do to get the load order to display plugins in non-timestamp order?

[Paul Rice]

BALO will be removed, but the ability to group plugins into user-defined groups will likely remain, IIRC for discussions on this and exclusion groups a while ago (though I can't recall any decision on the latter).

I think that it turned out that plugin grouping was still of some use to people (I think the example was for deactivating/activating sets of plugins?) so that would remain. However it sounds like you are using groups to position plugins automatically in your load order (ie. BALO) - this has been deprecated functionality for several releases, as the developers decided that BALO had been surpassed by BOSS a while ago.

So if you want automatic sorting, use BOSS. If you want to be able to group plugins in a manner that has no bearing on load order (as is likely what plugin grouping will be repurposed into), then you will still be able to do that after BALO is removed.

tl;dr: Groups will stay in, but they won't have anything to do with load order (probably) after BALO is removed.

Great - yes that was what came out of the discussion - groups should be separate from BALO they have many uses and it is an all too natural thing to have in any mod utility - still I don't know if there are any advanced group+BALO features that will be missed (nobody knows them all I guess, and probably the user that posted above could enlighten us)
On a related note IIRC re:Readme - it was argued that a monolithic readme is good to be around as a reference - one used to hit hit help in Bash then Cntl+F in FF and be able to locate all info in the readme pertaining to any particular keyword - now with the splitting of readmes what is the situation (as I see the single WB readme got deleted)
Also on a related note - maybe move the readmes to a docs/ folder (reduce the clutter in Mopy/) ?


Finally - now that you correct the installer script - dunno if those fixed :
Re: 295.5 installer

• When deselecting a game it would be convenient/less confusing to have the Python/Standalone options grayed out
  
• Still the space required shows 105 MB which is unlikely (I had all prerequisites installed - I faithfully install the Python version)

Thanks


Exclusion groups : I'd say let them stay - it is an advanced feature and I am contra simplifying Bash in principle - and it's been around for ever so it may break configurations - dunno

[Julie Serebrekoff]

I also have this problem. The load order is not based on timestamps. BOSS correctly set the timestamps, and WB can show the correct timestomp, but load orders are incorrect.

Although Oblivion still load using timestamps, this bug stops me from hand-sorting mods and rebuilding Bashed patch. If manual move is used,all the timestamps of the esps are automatically changed to fit the new(and wrong) load order.When rebuilding Bashed patch, WB will use the new loading order.

I reinstalled 295.5 and everything works fine.

Also, in this new order, Everything above Bashed patch,0.esp are in the correct order(yet missing some), all the missing esps are under Bashed patch,0.esp.

I use Python 2.7.3,Pywin32 217,wxPython 2.8.12.1 Unicode.

When first loading up 296 I had a problem with load orders set using BOSS, it had to do with ghosted plugins. With ghosting off Bash BOSS was able to correctly sort and BASH did not then go squiffy.

Very hard to see what's going on though.

[Rachel Tyson]

Great - yes that was what came out of the discussion - groups should be separate from BALO they have many uses and it is an all too natural thing to have in any mod utility - still I don't know if there are any advanced group+BALO features that will be missed (nobody knows them all I guess, and probably the user that posted above could enlighten us)
On a related note IIRC re:Readme - it was argued that a monolithic readme is good to be around as a reference - one used to hit hit help in Bash then Cntl+F in FF and be able to locate all info in the readme pertaining to any particular keyword - now with the splitting of readmes what is the situation (as I see the single WB readme got deleted)
Also on a related note - maybe move the readmes to a docs/ folder (reduce the clutter in Mopy/) ?


Finally - now that you correct the installer script - dunno if those fixed :
Re: 295.5 installer

• When deselecting a game it would be convenient/less confusing to have the Python/Standalone options grayed out
  
• Still the space required shows 105 MB which is unlikely (I had all prerequisites installed - I faithfully install the Python version)

Thanks


Exclusion groups : I'd say let them stay - it is an advanced feature and I am contra simplifying Bash in principle - and it's been around for ever so it may break configurations - dunno

I've tried to reference everything in the General readme, with links to the others when the actual content is in another doc, so Ctrl-F should still be useful. Having one massive readme just isn't going to work, there's too much to take in and it would scare users away. The old readme didn't contain a lot of stuff that the new ones do.

If you find that searching for something in the general readme doesn't return anything, then report it to me on a case-by-case basis and then I can improve the keywording where appropriate.

Moving the docs to a docs folder is a good idea. It'll need updating references to it in any code though. I'll do it when I next get time.

Can't comment on the installer stuff, that's mostly Alt3rn1ty's area of work.

Exclusion groups are bad because they require renaming plugins just so that WB can tell that they shouldn't be active at the same time. This is better handled by a metadata flag in a group, if Bash is to have knowledge of such things at all. Renaming plugins breaks dependent mods, savegame info and makes BOSS not recognise them.

[His Bella]

Re: 295.5 installer

• When deselecting a game it would be convenient/less confusing to have the Python/Standalone options grayed out
  
• Still the space required shows 105 MB which is unlikely (I had all prerequisites installed - I faithfully install the Python version)

Thanks

I haven't looked at these, still early days trying to figure things out and only touching that which I am pretty confident will not break anything .. Presenting the reasoning of it publicly so that someone else has chance to jump in screaming "HOLD YOUR HORSES!"

I have a few ideas for improving the installer, but whether I will achieve anything good at this time is not certain.

[Kevin S]

Still the space required shows 105 MB which is unlikely (I had all prerequisites installed - I faithfully install the Python version)

This might be related to wrye bash installing files by defining

File /r "*.*"

If we change to

...File "Mopy\bash\images\deeppaint16.png"File "Mopy\bash\images\deeppaint24.png"...

But you know, that's a long list.

[Ymani Hood]

Hello,

BOSS seems to work correctly for me, whether I launch it through WB, or independently :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/11b7a5194718465

This is confirmed when I check timestamps in the Windows explorer :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/a68386194718474

But when I open WB 296, I get these load order #IDs :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/9a1be0194718481

When instead, I think it should be :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/d2b916194718489

About replicating it, it seems very configuration dependant. If I remove some ESPs in my load order, it works correctly again.

For whatever it's worth, neither the "faulty" ESP (Skyrimized Water), nor the random ESPs I remove from my load to make it work again, appear in my (BOSS) userlist.txt, so I am pretty much at loss helping you pinpointing why it happens >.<

I'll keep looking though. As I said, it appears rather minor bug to me, as long as nothing else relies on load order #IDs to work with, instead of actual timestamps.

tes4Edit displays the correct #IDs, and so I'd assume tes4LODgen, so there's no harm done (as far as I'm concerned).

Looks like a bug to me. Does it happen when you run BOSS independently of WB (ie. are the timestamps after running and the order displayed in the BOSS Log also mismatched)? What happens if you close WB and re-open it, are they still mismatched (ie. is it a refresh issue)?

[Mario Alcantar]

@alt3rn1ty & wrinlyninja : thanks - I'll be sure to report anything I stumble upon

[Stat Wrecker]

Hello,

BOSS seems to work correctly for me, whether I launch it through WB, or independently :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/11b7a5194718465

This is confirmed when I check timestamps in the Windows explorer :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/a68386194718474

But when I open WB 296, I get these load order #IDs :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/9a1be0194718481

When instead, I think it should be :

http://www.imagebam.com/image/d2b916194718489

About replicating it, it seems very configuration dependant. If I remove some ESPs in my load order, it works correctly again.

For whatever it's worth, neither the "faulty" ESP (Skyrimized Water), nor the random ESPs I remove from my load to make it work again, appear in my (BOSS) userlist.txt, so I am pretty much at loss helping you pinpointing why it happens >.<

I'll keep looking though. As I said, it appears rather minor bug to me, as long as nothing else relies on load order #IDs to work with, instead of actual timestamps.

tes4Edit displays the correct #IDs, and so I'd assume tes4LODgen, so there's no harm done (as far as I'm concerned).

Just a tag of "me too" on this topic.

In 296 it seems it's directly related to auto-ghosting (for me anyway), as when I turn off auto-ghosting the sort by Load Order remains the same as the Sort by Timestamp (Which is correct based on my Boss log report). I can then rebuild my patch and turn auto-ghost back on before I exit WB.

And again, fine in 295.5 svn2242, for what it's worth. And it's the only problem I have (so far) with 296.

Thanks again guys and gals.
Hawk

[Donald Richards]

Yeah, auto-ghosting is known to be broken. Can't recall if it's fixed for 297 though.

[Natalie J Webster]

My mistake, I have one other problem (so far)

I get this when I try to Load a Saved Mod List:

Traceback (most recent call last):  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\basher.py", line 11207, in DoList	errorMessage = bosh.modInfos.selectExact(selectList)  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bosh.py", line 5475, in selectExact	boss.SetActivePlugins(modNames)  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bapi.py", line 582, in SetActivePlugins	_CSetActivePlugins(self._DB, plugins, num)  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bapi.py", line 226, in BossErrorCheck	raise BossError(result)bash.bapi.BossError: BossError: BOSS_API_ERROR_INVALID_ARGS:Plugins may not be sorted before the game's master file.

And then doesn't load it.

Thanks again folks...

Hawk


Just saw your post Wrinkly... thanks for that.

[ILy- Forver]

My mistake, I have one other problem (so far)

I get this when I try to Load a Saved Mod List:

Traceback (most recent call last):  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\basher.py", line 11207, in DoList	errorMessage = bosh.modInfos.selectExact(selectList)  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bosh.py", line 5475, in selectExact	boss.SetActivePlugins(modNames)  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bapi.py", line 582, in SetActivePlugins	_CSetActivePlugins(self._DB, plugins, num)  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bapi.py", line 226, in BossErrorCheck	raise BossError(result)bash.bapi.BossError: BossError: BOSS_API_ERROR_INVALID_ARGS:Plugins may not be sorted before the game's master file.

And then doesn't load it.

Thanks again folks...

Hawk


Just saw your post Wrinkly... thanks for that.

Fixed in 297, I think.

[Chris Duncan]

Yes, that's fixed for 297.

[Genevieve]

Huh. It seems that Wrye Bash is confused about how load orders work in Oblivion.
It seems to be convinced that it uses some sort of system like Skyrim does, when it actually uses time stamping.
I guess this is a known error, since it's such a huge issue. Oblivion.esm I have set to be timestamped for the year 1981, as a test, at least ten years before the next thing is stamped.
Yet Oblivion.esm is at position 0F, where as the next file I have, Diverse Magic Effects.esm is set at 08, and the file at position 00 is Francesco's Leveled Creatures-Items Mod.esm dated at 2006.
I guess the file I downloaded is very confused.

[carrie roche]

For those of you who have been following along, 297 is out now with the following changes:

297 [07/6/2012] [Trira,Daidalos,Arthmoor,wrinklyninja,alt3rn1ty,Other community members]

• Some potential lag relief for Bash's use of BAPI.
  
• Replaced documentation with WrinklyNinja's rewritten documents.
  
• Added an option to launch the BOSS GUI to the BOSS icon.
  
• Added an archery distance tweak to the default ini tweaks for Skyrim.
  
• Improved support for launching Skyrim's creation kit: Bash now displays the correct icon and supplies the correct launch parameters.
  
• Moved default patchers and ini tweaks for Oblivion and Skyrim into the Mopy folder: user-installed patchers and tweaks will continue to go in their folders within each game's Data folder.
  
• Fixed applying INI Tweaks via the "Apply" choice.
  
• Fixed BAIN skipping the Data\Docs folder of packages when running for Skyrim.
  
• Fixed BAIN skipping SkyUI files when Skip Docs was enabled.
  
• Fixed the Bashed Patch ignoring some active plugins due to having an older timestamp in Skyrim.
  
• Fixed Bash not reading Bash Tags from BOSS's masterlist.
  
• Fixed Load Masters on a save in the Saves tab causing a BAPI error.
  
• Fixed an error when switching between mod lists.
  
• Fixed the Bash Tags box being uneditable when running for Skyrim.
  
• Removed the Version 0.8 context menu command in the Mods tab when running for Skyrim.
  
• Fixed manually-set Bash Tags not being remembered by Wrye Bash after it is restarted.
  
• Fixed time format errors being displayed when the auto-update option was set.
  
• Updated all Nexus URLs to use the new URLs.
  
• Fixed world orphan removal command.
  
• Fixed Bashed Patch not being activated when user chooses to do so through the post-rebuild dialog.
  
• Fixed various installer bugs and made some improvements.

[Sandeep Khatkar]

Alright. Lag is better. Still terrible, but I think we've graduated from "unusable" to "highly irritating"

Oh yeah, and it actually works, unlike 296 did. So there is that. At least so far.

Got this output again when rebuilding my patch the first time:

Spoiler

Debugging buildPatch - Skipping ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x006EEC) in mod ( 1em_Vilja_as_Chocolate_Elf.esp )due to invalid formIDs
fid : ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x006EEC)
flags1 : 0x0L
flags2 : 0x5b06L
eid : u'NordVilja'
full : u'Nord'
text : u'Citizens of Skyrim, they are a tall and fair-haired people. Strong and hardy, Nords are famous for their resistance to cold. They are highly talented warriors.'
spells : [ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x047AE2), ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x047AE3), ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x047AE4)]
relations_list : [(ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x0224FD), 5)]
skill1 : -1
skill1Boost : 0
skill2 : -1
skill2Boost : 0
skill3 : -1
skill3Boost : 0
skill4 : 18
skill4Boost : 15
skill5 : 19
skill5Boost : 5
skill6 : 25
skill6Boost : 20
skill7 : 27
skill7Boost : 5
maleHeight : 1.06
femaleHeight : 1.0
maleWeight : 1.1
femaleWeight : 1.0
flags : 0x0L
maleVoice : EmptyFormID(None, None)
femaleVoice : EmptyFormID(None, None)
defaultHairMale : ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x1236DB)
defaultHairFemale : ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x1236DB)
defaultHairColor : 9
mainClamp : 5.0
faceClamp : 3.0
maleStrength : 50
maleIntelligence : 30
maleAgility : 40
maleSpeed : 40
maleEndurance : 50
malePersonality : 30
maleLuck : 50
femaleStrength : 50
femaleIntelligence : 30
femaleWillpower : 30
femaleAgility : 40
femaleSpeed : 40
femaleEndurance : 50
femalePersonality : 30
femaleLuck : 50
head_list : (u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Head\\corean_head4.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Chocolate\\ChocolateFace1.dds', [])
maleEars_list : (u'characters\\darkelf\\earsdarkelf.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Chocolate\\EarsChocolate.dds', [])
femaleEars_list : (u'characters\\darkelf\\earsdarkelf.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Chocolate\\EarsChocolate.dds', [])
mouth_list : (u'Characters\\Imperial\\MouthHuman.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\MouthHuman.dds', [])
teethLower_list : (u'Characters\\Imperial\\TeethLowerHuman.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\TeethLowerHuman.dds', [])
teethUpper_list : (u'characters\\Corean\\teeth\\teethupper.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\TeethUpperHuman.dds', [])
tongue_list : (u'Characters\\Imperial\\TongueHuman.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\TongueHuman.dds', [])
leftEye_list : (u'characters\\Corean\\Eyes\\coreanEye02L.nif', 0.0, None, [])
rightEye_list : (u'characters\\Corean\\Eyes\\coreanEye02R.nif', 0.0, None, [])
maleTail_list : (None, None, [])
maleUpperBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\UpperBodyMale.dds'
maleLowerBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\LegMale.dds'
maleHandPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\HandMale.dds'
maleFootPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\FootMale.dds'
maleTailPath : None
femaleTail_list : (None, None, [])
femaleUpperBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\UpperBodyFemale.dds'
femaleLowerBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\LegFemale.dds'
femaleHandPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\HandFemale.dds'
femaleFootPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\FootFemale.dds'
femaleTailPath : None
hairs : [ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x1236DB), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C303), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C304), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C305), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C306), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C307), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C308), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C309), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30A), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30B), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30C), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30D), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30E), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30F), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C310), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C311), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C312), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C313), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C314), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C315), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C316), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C317), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C318), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C319), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31A), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31B), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31C), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31D), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31E), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31F), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C320), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C321), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C322), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C323), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C324), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C325)]
eyes : [ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x055AAA), ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x055AAB), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2EF), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F0), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F1), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F2), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F3), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F4), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F5), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F6), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F7), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F8), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FA), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FB), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FC), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FD), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FE), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FF), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C300), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C301), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C302)]
fggs_p : [3, 132, 174, 63, 175, 113, 162, 191, 134, 121, 145, 188, 128, 214, 221, 62, 40, 21, 154, 187, 18, 81, 1, 64, 206, 244, 29, 64, 124, 137, 41, 192, 57, 210, 198, 63, 238, 205, 217, 62, 171, 194, 195, 191, 116, 246, 191, 62, 52, 14, 196, 63, 224, 91, 37, 190, 236, 145, 162, 63, 206, 203, 114, 191, 207, 99, 68, 64, 93, 185, 195, 191, 139, 229, 154, 192, 38, 32, 184, 191, 153, 43, 163, 63, 140, 239, 0, 192, 128, 89, 158, 63, 122, 26, 162, 192, 64, 203, 231, 63, 67, 124, 186, 191, 54, 180, 210, 61, 130, 205, 96, 190, 17, 200, 1, 63, 166, 69, 244, 63, 143, 88, 44, 64, 24, 68, 94, 63, 140, 56, 76, 192, 232, 241, 67, 63, 203, 146, 129, 191, 40, 1, 138, 192, 7, 253, 72, 64, 94, 97, 49, 64, 121, 146, 105, 191, 159, 104, 235, 63, 129, 57, 27, 63, 237, 109, 132, 63, 250, 253, 199, 191, 56, 172, 55, 64, 36, 149, 251, 63, 16, 210, 199, 190, 231, 27, 198, 63, 154, 14, 29, 192, 168, 246, 81, 63, 44, 112, 155, 192]
fgga_p : [0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0]
fgts_p : [160, 61, 50, 188, 201, 100, 131, 61, 105, 89, 159, 189, 76, 102, 120, 189, 205, 157, 42, 189, 236, 83, 218, 60, 119, 211, 19, 62, 148, 7, 110, 188, 103, 110, 164, 60, 248, 54, 115, 188, 4, 170, 47, 61, 1, 235, 167, 59, 111, 246, 215, 188, 240, 33, 85, 59, 124, 104, 14, 189, 172, 103, 9, 60, 151, 241, 14, 189, 61, 254, 220, 189, 170, 241, 130, 61, 22, 184, 171, 60, 20, 212, 93, 61, 190, 165, 163, 187, 86, 95, 197, 189, 30, 37, 145, 61, 108, 147, 207, 60, 207, 0, 99, 189, 126, 67, 138, 60, 182, 37, 135, 60, 193, 87, 190, 60, 100, 230, 106, 61, 104, 193, 24, 188, 47, 57, 100, 189, 30, 170, 68, 61, 96, 121, 41, 189, 184, 40, 17, 60, 248, 119, 167, 61, 34, 143, 105, 189, 217, 233, 5, 61, 54, 186, 30, 189, 108, 30, 141, 61, 252, 206, 153, 188, 84, 76, 150, 189, 166, 178, 72, 187, 38, 76, 134, 187, 114, 148, 76, 189, 160, 105, 151, 61, 86, 56, 175, 189, 155, 106, 85, 187, 60, 24, 118, 189, 138, 143, 96, 61]
snam_p : [160, 15]
Debugging mergeModFile - Skipping ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x006EEC) in mod ( 1em_Vilja_as_Chocolate_Elf.esp )due to invalid formIDs
fid : ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x006EEC)
flags1 : 0x0L
flags2 : 0x5b06L
eid : u'NordVilja'
full : u'Nord'
text : u'Citizens of Skyrim, they are a tall and fair-haired people. Strong and hardy, Nords are famous for their resistance to cold. They are highly talented warriors.'
spells : [ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x047AE2), ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x047AE3), ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x047AE4)]
relations_list : [(ValidFormID('Oblivion.esm', 0x0224FD), 5)]
skill1 : -1
skill1Boost : 0
skill2 : -1
skill2Boost : 0
skill3 : -1
skill3Boost : 0
skill4 : 18
skill4Boost : 15
skill5 : 19
skill5Boost : 5
skill6 : 25
skill6Boost : 20
skill7 : 27
skill7Boost : 5
maleHeight : 1.06
femaleHeight : 1.0
maleWeight : 1.1
femaleWeight : 1.0
flags : 0x0L
maleVoice : EmptyFormID(None, None)
femaleVoice : EmptyFormID(None, None)
defaultHairMale : ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x1236DB)
defaultHairFemale : ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x1236DB)
defaultHairColor : 9
mainClamp : 5.0
faceClamp : 3.0
maleStrength : 50
maleIntelligence : 30
maleAgility : 40
maleSpeed : 40
maleEndurance : 50
malePersonality : 30
maleLuck : 50
femaleStrength : 50
femaleIntelligence : 30
femaleWillpower : 30
femaleAgility : 40
femaleSpeed : 40
femaleEndurance : 50
femalePersonality : 30
femaleLuck : 50
head_list : (u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Head\\corean_head4.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Chocolate\\ChocolateFace1.dds', [])
maleEars_list : (u'characters\\darkelf\\earsdarkelf.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Chocolate\\EarsChocolate.dds', [])
femaleEars_list : (u'characters\\darkelf\\earsdarkelf.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Chocolate\\EarsChocolate.dds', [])
mouth_list : (u'Characters\\Imperial\\MouthHuman.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\MouthHuman.dds', [])
teethLower_list : (u'Characters\\Imperial\\TeethLowerHuman.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\TeethLowerHuman.dds', [])
teethUpper_list : (u'characters\\Corean\\teeth\\teethupper.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\TeethUpperHuman.dds', [])
tongue_list : (u'Characters\\Imperial\\TongueHuman.nif', 0.0, u'Characters\\Imperial\\TongueHuman.dds', [])
leftEye_list : (u'characters\\Corean\\Eyes\\coreanEye02L.nif', 0.0, None, [])
rightEye_list : (u'characters\\Corean\\Eyes\\coreanEye02R.nif', 0.0, None, [])
maleTail_list : (None, None, [])
maleUpperBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\UpperBodyMale.dds'
maleLowerBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\LegMale.dds'
maleHandPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\HandMale.dds'
maleFootPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Male\\FootMale.dds'
maleTailPath : None
femaleTail_list : (None, None, [])
femaleUpperBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\UpperBodyFemale.dds'
femaleLowerBodyPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\LegFemale.dds'
femaleHandPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\HandFemale.dds'
femaleFootPath : u'Characters\\Chocolate\\Female\\FootFemale.dds'
femaleTailPath : None
hairs : [ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x1236DB), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C303), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C304), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C305), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C306), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C307), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C308), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C309), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30A), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30B), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30C), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30D), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30E), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C30F), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C310), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C311), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C312), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C313), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C314), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C315), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C316), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C317), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C318), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C319), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31A), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31B), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31C), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31D), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31E), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C31F), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C320), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C321), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C322), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C323), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C324), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C325)]
eyes : [ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x055AAA), ValidFormID('1em_Vilja.esp', 0x055AAB), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2EF), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F0), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F1), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F2), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F3), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F4), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F5), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F6), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F7), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2F8), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FA), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FB), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FC), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FD), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FE), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C2FF), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C300), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C301), InvalidFormID(None, 0xFF11C302)]
fggs_p : [3, 132, 174, 63, 175, 113, 162, 191, 134, 121, 145, 188, 128, 214, 221, 62, 40, 21, 154, 187, 18, 81, 1, 64, 206, 244, 29, 64, 124, 137, 41, 192, 57, 210, 198, 63, 238, 205, 217, 62, 171, 194, 195, 191, 116, 246, 191, 62, 52, 14, 196, 63, 224, 91, 37, 190, 236, 145, 162, 63, 206, 203, 114, 191, 207, 99, 68, 64, 93, 185, 195, 191, 139, 229, 154, 192, 38, 32, 184, 191, 153, 43, 163, 63, 140, 239, 0, 192, 128, 89, 158, 63, 122, 26, 162, 192, 64, 203, 231, 63, 67, 124, 186, 191, 54, 180, 210, 61, 130, 205, 96, 190, 17, 200, 1, 63, 166, 69, 244, 63, 143, 88, 44, 64, 24, 68, 94, 63, 140, 56, 76, 192, 232, 241, 67, 63, 203, 146, 129, 191, 40, 1, 138, 192, 7, 253, 72, 64, 94, 97, 49, 64, 121, 146, 105, 191, 159, 104, 235, 63, 129, 57, 27, 63, 237, 109, 132, 63, 250, 253, 199, 191, 56, 172, 55, 64, 36, 149, 251, 63, 16, 210, 199, 190, 231, 27, 198, 63, 154, 14, 29, 192, 168, 246, 81, 63, 44, 112, 155, 192]
fgga_p : [0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0]
fgts_p : [160, 61, 50, 188, 201, 100, 131, 61, 105, 89, 159, 189, 76, 102, 120, 189, 205, 157, 42, 189, 236, 83, 218, 60, 119, 211, 19, 62, 148, 7, 110, 188, 103, 110, 164, 60, 248, 54, 115, 188, 4, 170, 47, 61, 1, 235, 167, 59, 111, 246, 215, 188, 240, 33, 85, 59, 124, 104, 14, 189, 172, 103, 9, 60, 151, 241, 14, 189, 61, 254, 220, 189, 170, 241, 130, 61, 22, 184, 171, 60, 20, 212, 93, 61, 190, 165, 163, 187, 86, 95, 197, 189, 30, 37, 145, 61, 108, 147, 207, 60, 207, 0, 99, 189, 126, 67, 138, 60, 182, 37, 135, 60, 193, 87, 190, 60, 100, 230, 106, 61, 104, 193, 24, 188, 47, 57, 100, 189, 30, 170, 68, 61, 96, 121, 41, 189, 184, 40, 17, 60, 248, 119, 167, 61, 34, 143, 105, 189, 217, 233, 5, 61, 54, 186, 30, 189, 108, 30, 141, 61, 252, 206, 153, 188, 84, 76, 150, 189, 166, 178, 72, 187, 38, 76, 134, 187, 114, 148, 76, 189, 160, 105, 151, 61, 86, 56, 175, 189, 155, 106, 85, 187, 60, 24, 118, 189, 138, 143, 96, 61]
snam_p : [160, 15]

Going to rebuild a second time caused the interface to go nuts, flickering and acting all sorts of weird. Canceled out, tried again. Didn't happen. Rebuilding the patch gave me the same output as above. Something is up with the Vilja Chocolate Elf plugin, though I'm not sure what Bash's problem with it is, precisely.

[Sara Johanna Scenariste]

Huh. It seems that Wrye Bash is confused about how load orders work in Oblivion.
It seems to be convinced that it uses some sort of system like Skyrim does, when it actually uses time stamping.
I guess this is a known error, since it's such a huge issue. Oblivion.esm I have set to be timestamped for the year 1981, as a test, at least ten years before the next thing is stamped.
Yet Oblivion.esm is at position 0F, where as the next file I have, Diverse Magic Effects.esm is set at 08, and the file at position 00 is Francesco's Leveled Creatures-Items Mod.esm dated at 2006.
I guess the file I downloaded is very confused.

Try deleting your Mopy folder before installing 297. It could be something to do with leftover files confusing Bash, I suppose. That would explain why I'm not seeing it, since I built my install off the SVN.

[Sammygirl500]

Still intermittently getting that flickering phenomenon why trying to rebuild the patch, it sends CPU usage through the roof, since it affects DWM.exe and other non-Bash programs. Bash's CPU usage actually drops during it.

Anyway, have run into an error with Bash displaying the proper load order. I noticed it when I got a Delinquent Master error when trying to build a patch. Looking into it, I noticed that the Load Order displayed and the Dates Displayed were http://fencedude.com/Oblivion/WB297LoadOrder.png. The dates are correct, but the Load Order displayed by Bash is wrong.

Also, when upgrading from 295.5 to 297 I did not get a message prompting me to backup my settings. I had done so beforehand, of course. Just in case.

[Stefanny Cardona]

Is there a list of what records are compatible with Import NoMerge? I can't find one, and I know that there are some that don't work. Disregarding the ones that should, and don't in CBash, of course.

[Sunnii Bebiieh]

Sorry, I don't think such a list exists. What doesn't work with Import+NoMerge?

[quinnnn]

Sorry, I don't think such a list exists. What doesn't work with Import+NoMerge?

Well, mostly I'm trying to figure out what the restrictions on it are.

I know I try to do it with Scripts and it failed, for example.

This feature, and how it differs from merging, is not very well documented. I finally figured it out myself, but the Advanced Readme at least should probably cover why its used in some situations.

[Teghan Harris]

I've always understood import to be a more surgically precise way to get what you want. Straight merging takes whatever is in the file and copies it ALL to the patch. Importing only grabs specific data. Like with the book jackets mod. CBash apparently can merge the whole thing, but I personally only want the actual graphics changes. So instead of letting it merge that, I flag it as "import graphics" so the texture replacements get done but it doesn't otherwise disturb book placement. I happen to think bookshelves with upsidedown bindings indicates someone actually uses the library and so adds a touch of character to things.

[Alexander Horton]

I've always understood import to be a more surgically precise way to get what you want. Straight merging takes whatever is in the file and copies it ALL to the patch. Importing only grabs specific data. Like with the book jackets mod. CBash apparently can merge the whole thing, but I personally only want the actual graphics changes. So instead of letting it merge that, I flag it as "import graphics" so the texture replacements get done but it doesn't otherwise disturb book placement. I happen to think bookshelves with upsidedown bindings indicates someone actually uses the library and so adds a touch of character to things.

Well, yeah. I figured that out eventually. The problem is that this isn't actually documented anywhere. And as I said, I have no idea if there are tags it doesn't work at all with or what.

[LijLuva]

Import should be able to handle any tag that's listed in the patch building menu - that's pretty much the whole reason that menu exists

Noted on it not being documented. I'm sure Wrinklyninja will get to it as time permits.

[Euan]

Hi WB Folks

Couple of problems on 297 (Python Version)

First the Auto-Ghosting/Load Order problem still exists for me.

Second, when trying to rebuild my Bash Patch I get this little error after the check for mergibility routine...

Traceback (most recent call last):  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\basher.py", line 17729, in Execute	patchDialog = PatchDialog(self.window,fileInfo,self.doCBash,importConfig)  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\basher.py", line 10187, in __init__	patcher.getConfig(patchConfigs) #--Will set patcher.isEnabled  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bosh.py", line 15178, in getConfig	self.getAutoItems()  File "F:\Games\(The Elder Scrolls)\TES IV\(Resources)\Wrye Bash\Mopy\bash\bosh.py", line 15153, in getAutoItems	autoNames.add(fileName)NameError: global name 'autoNames' is not defined

Then it fails...

This happens for all of my Saved Mod Lists.

On the bright side, I can save and Load my Mod Lists.

Any Ideas, or is this a known and working on kinda thing?

Almost Forgot - Wrye Bash 297 Python Version with Python 2.7 (Wrye Python 217) on Windows XP 32 bit...

Anything else you need, just let me know... For now I'm still stable under 295.5

Thanks Folks,
Hawk