On the topic of Yagrum, I've always wondered if the defeat of Dagoth Ur meant that the effects of Corprus would gradually wane, including for those already stricken with it. I suppose not, and even if they did, the Dwarf would still probably be pretty mentally traumatized and debilitated by the time he had Corprus in his system. I think the more logical conjecture is that the disease merely stopped spreading, and all those in the Corprusarium would continue to spend the rest of eternity afflicted by it. Sad.

Unfortunately, it seems as if we'll never know.

It is sad at that, though I suspect the corprus victims' suffering ended when Red Mountain cooked off, if not sooner. As for the Nerevarine, the game "Morrowind" indicated he or she would keep the beneficial aspects of corprus (immortality, disease resistance) without the madness and deformed body. I don't think the Nerevarine is dead; I prefer to think he or she is still exploring Akavir, though we'll probably never find out what happened to him/her.

My first Morrowind character actually got "cured" of Corprus before ever catching a single ordinary disease, so I really lucked out on some interesting gameplay urgencies there. Of course, the immortality is presumably just against aging (as is the case with most "search for immortality" stories), so if Bethesda wants to continue to spite us Morrowind fans they could gladly kill him/her off too. I'm assuming it won't come to that, though - they give us Daggerfall players too little reference as it is. :violin:

When exactly did Yagrum acquire Corprus? Seeing how he'd have to be centuries old (assuming time didn't progress slower during his time in the "Outer Realms") by the time of Morrowind, I'm assuming it was a while back. Then again, he is a Dwemer and could probably live a few centuries with or without magical interference, like the other Mer do. On the topic of the disease, I, again, always assumed it came into being with Dagoth Ur's resurgence, but it's possible that it may have emerged while the Sixth House was still sleeping beneath Red Mountain.

My Nerevarine is still around, though in most other parts of the Empire he goes by the title Champion of Cyrodiil or his much older (and now mostly forgotten title) the Eternal Champion - likely the people will soon forget him again, forcing him to once again rise up and claim another title under which to claim renown.

Not to mention that there's reason to suggest that the Dwemer had already made themselves immortal (reference http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/nerevar_redmountain.shtml and http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/battle_redmountain.shtml). This might also explain why Yagrum's held up as well as he has against corprus - most other folks seem to progress rather quickly into ravenous beasts, yet Yagrum has managed to get away with little more than some bloating and memory loss despite having been afflicted for hundreds of years...

If I remember correctly, when Yagrum explains came back to Red Mountain, after initially searching all over for his people, caught the Corprus disease, and did go insane for a while. It wasn't until Dyviath Fyr came around and cared for him that Yagrum regained his sanity.

While this is true, the other patients Fyr has helped still are insane.

Going back to what Luagar2 said, Yagrum is a special case.

Divayth and Yagrum better show up in the next ES game.

What I'd like to know is, seeing as how there was a good while for folks to get ready for the ministry to unfreeze and finally smite Vivec City like it wanted to for all those years, why didn't they just break it up before then? The temple had no problem burrowing into the dang thing and clearing out large areas and tunnels, so why not just mine the whole thing out? Even if they could only hollow it out and not break it up completily due to some strange magibabble quirk of Vivec's original enchantment, removing so much of its mass means that even when it does finally get back into gear it might just very well disintegrate on impact.


In other words, because he was an arrogent dike.

The question is, what would happen to all those little bits. For instance, somewhere there was some collector or priest who kept bits of the moon which had been burrowed out on his mantle as holy relics. What happened to these when the ministry fell? Did they too keep their "original intention intact", was the priest sitting there and suddenly his house collapsed as all these bits of debris came slamming down into the floor with untold force.

If he was arrogant wouldn't he have assume that the people could never lose love for him?

Considering he felt himself hot enough stuff that he basically went "love me or be destroyed" to the city he's supposed to be a god to, and doing so with an instrument of destruction he SAVED them from, yeah, I would say he's pretty darn arrogent, or at least was at the time (though if he DID change, one would think he'd have done something later on about the Ministry - five minutes of the ghostgate going down seems like a slap on the wrist compared to a big ol' comet smiting his namesake city (where he LIVES, no less)).

Considering that this is written scripture, of all things, it's surprising Vvardenfell wasn't blown to bits centuries before it was - you'd think folks would doubt a god who inflicts pain for his own ego.

Almalexia's Ordinators ensured that anyone who brought that up was stuck in the Ministry and reconditioned.

They'd have to be locking up EVERYBODY, then, 'cause inbetween that big ol' thing sitting above Vivec and all the copies of that sermon floating around and sheer word-of-mouth and discussion most EVERYBODY in the city, if not the entire island or nation, knows that story and has talked about it and must've thought about the last few lines of that sermon (heck, that makes one wonder if the ordinators even CAN do anything, since it's canon that Vivec is basically holding a gun to the city's head and demanding tribute).

It seems like the vast majority of them see it not as Vivec threatening them, but offering to protect them from it. He's built quite a reputation among the settled Dunmer as a hero and protector from the devices of the Four Corners and the Sixth House, his actions above fault. Note that the settled Dunmer also consider madness, another product of Sheogorath (as well as Dagoth Ur, to a degree), to be a result of abandoning the Temple and falling into wickedness.

Meh, I'll chalk this up as a win for the temple's propaganda machine.

I was thinking about that first and more on-topic comment you made, though - thing is, while the Ministry as a whole was frozen, given that they were able to excavate rock and whatever else was in there and take it out to do whatever with it, since the temple was able to remove all those little bits, it seems as though the excavated rock is considered seperate from the ministry itself - if every bit was still considered a part of the whole, it stands to reason then that the Temple wouldn't have been able to take it out since Vivec's frozen it stuck.

All gods are arrogant in this sense, just look at the real world religion - if you don't like them, they'll send you in hell or worse. Or look at the Greek gods... they are all the same.

With that Vivec saying 'silly hortator, i would have done so myself....' to Nerervar - I assume he is talking to Nerevarine right? As Vehk wasnt a god when Nerevar was alive right?

He was talking to Nerevar. It's thought that when the Tribunal tapped into the Heart of Lorkhan, they not only became gods but also rewrote reality so that Vivec the god existed before the birth of Vivec the mortal. They didn't consciously edit reality, but reality changed itself to accomodate the existence of new gods.

As opposed to, y'know, just writing the canon of the next 2000 years to make them look like bona fide and legit gods?

Pretty much, yeah.

When I first played "Morrowind", I thought the Temple's scriptures had been made up by anonymous priests or by Vivec, but after being on the Elder Scrolls forums for a while I realized we're meant to take the scriptures literally.

This is a really interesting point - In the past I would've just said that most of the events that transpired in The 36 Lessons are pure fiction or perhaps events that were just a little embellished to suit The Tribunal's goals. But after reading http://www.imperial-library.info/fsg/astionarticle1.shtml and realising that not all in The Lessons was fiction; I realised that when The Tribunal made themselves Gods they changed reality or even set history onto a different time line where the events from The Lessons did indeed occur.

Very interesting.

You just gave yourself away.

Every Dark Elf child knows that Saint Jiub chased the Cliff Racers away years before the moon fell.

/\

That didn't last. The newest incarnation of King Wulfhart chased them back to Vvardenfell.