I rly dont get why did they removed economy they were talking about, that would be the only thing that would make difference between Skyrim and Oblivion.What did they add? Only dragons encounters that are kinda ok. [And ofc Smithing and alchemy that makes game more unbalanced and abusable for progress]
But they only hit the surface of Cooking that is of no use, Grain mill that doesnt even have effect, Lumber mill also,
6 years difference between this 2 games and yet its the same game, I dont see any progress they made, especialy NPCs behavior.
Example? Kill a NPC. Guard : "Ow...what happend"?Walks away*
Example? Always same scripted talking to other NPCs
Whole game is unfinished
Got my point?


Bad english :swear:

I trully agree and worst i feel the difference is worst then oblivion not to mention Morrowind. quest line are worst, to quick and to repititive. they have use Copy/paste a lot in the scrypt in skyrim.

I think your wayyy off here... Its not just about "adding" new things; Its about the story and the enjoyment of playing a new game with some nice extras added on. The story is the main reason we play.

And they have added ALOT to this game... the Animations have been massively improved, total new crafting systems, more food and ingredients, better environment (insects etc), better graphics, improved draw distance and a massive improvement to the engine and combat. Eveything moves more smoothly than previous games... its no longer jagged movements.

And six years in not that long... I think they have come far.

at least it isn't like MW3, where they used the exact same engine for game after game.

And afai-cansee you're just whining. This game is a humongous improvement from Oblivion.

I think its easy to criticise things like this... but you have to ask, what more do you want? you have made half an argument... give a list of what it is you want in the game...

Put you self in the developers shoes they are not gods they are people... you say repetitive quests but what would YOU do?

???
Well....
Today i killed someone in the market place
A bunch of ppl ran over to the body and started screaming for the gaurds
Then the gaurds came and one asked me where i was at the time
And said because i had my sword out i was suspicious
Then i bribed my way out of it
This wasnt Part of a quest but the ai reacting to a senario i created

I dont remember that in oblivion
But maybe you could prove me wrong?

I can agree with OP to an extent but tbh I felt Skyrim did somethings much better than previous games and some thins MUCH WORSE that previous games. I hate the lack of info during quests that I have to use quest markers just to do anything.

5 years, 3 in the making. Not saying I disagree with your sentiment, but your facts are wrong.

Cool. As I play a goody two shoes I don't murder people but this sounds great. :spotted owl:

Actually, Skyrim is quite different from Oblivion, I mean, vanilla Oblivion.
Skyrim contains almost all elements from famous mods in Oblivion.
However, that's all what it got.
Skyrim is just like Oblivion installed with mods, but there is nothing really innovative.
The console based interface for PC is even a disaster.

@Dragonbone Yes its 5, but im not talking about when did they start making it, im talking about RPG evolution. You cant find any revolutionary addons to game.Yes story line is great but I dont see what the problem of making game complete at least in some obviously points.
Why do trees you cut down in lumber mill dissapear,why cant we fill in trees and make arrows cheaper like that,why cant we fight and talk from horses,why cant we order our followers to run away from enemy NPC instead rushing on it ,why NPC and guards dont complain when u burn their houses and so on
Maybe I am asking for too much, but you can see they "touch" the surface of that things but why they cant complete them,Maybe I am wrong but that doesnt seem so hard
So basicly what my point is if they added some things, why they didnt make them detailed beacuse you often get suprised when you see sawed tree disappear.

After all its just a game but I want to know reason why they make incomplete games, 3 years is enough I think

I am gonna serial murder complainers if i see one more topic like this.



(not really but you get the point)

in ob you could kill ppl and pay the fine?! i dont see a big deal here, they still only fined u [censored] all
for murder let you loose and left the body in the street. yeah alot has changed... how about the put the body in the undercroft, tagged family and friends attend a send off ect. you get exciled or imprisioned for life(i hate the wait out your sentence choice, when u have killed a small army of ppl. dont worry a week in a cell is fine... you should always have to escape for big crimes)

I feel that it is much different from Oblivion.

Voice actors are better, I can still hear the same one Arnold over and over but his voice acting isn't as dreadful as Oblivion's.
Lore is better represented with racial issues.
Graphics are a plus.
Combat is much better, Oblivions became stale fast.
Dragons.
Actual dialogue, while simplistic and not very branching it's an improvement over Oblivion and Morrowinds 'topic dialogue'.
NPC reactions are better, NPC's comment on what I'm wearing, what I have equipped and what I've done previously.
A lot of the quests feel way better, in Oblivion a lot of them just felt like they barely had any content to them.
And dungeons, while draughr tombs get repetitive, are a lot more varied from Oblivions.
I also like that spells are actual spells now instead of just touch, self or target.

So while still keeping the same Oblivion design a lot of improvements has been made.
Oblivion, I couldn't figure out why I kept playing it, it felt so unpolished, repetitive and like it had no soul.
Skyrim on the other hand feels like a real game and not just some halfassed quantity-mod.

I sort of agree. It's not like they actually had to add a whole bunch of new content, but I, too, see little to no progress. Yes, dragon encounters, great, except they svck. Hard. In fact, they actually took out a lot of stuff and the few additions feel gimmicky, pointless or, in case of changed stuff, are worse than they used to. That doesn't mean it isn't still a great game, though, but a lot of the old issues the TESs were plagued by are still as strong as ever, too, as they did not even try to improve anything about them. On top of it, the game is bugged like crazy and suffers form a lopt of mino annoyances (quest items ect.), much worse than I remember Oblivion to have been.

Well, at least the healing spell doesn't throw fireballs, right?

It's Oblivion 2.0 - polished, smooth, beautiful, but gimped by the set release date (11-11-11) and the old hardware.

I was expecting never to get weary of Skyrim, and yet I find myself bored with nothing substantial to do after 70 hours. I will continue exploring, working on my book collection, and investigate all dungeons every now and then, but if Oblivion lacked something from Morrowind, then Skyrim lacks something from Oblivion. Though similar in many ways, there was a certain depth in Oblivion which I'm yet to see in Skyrim, where everything seems half done.

-The character creation and advancement system is more open-ended.

-There are actual crafting skills, now. Some of them have little impact on character development, true, but that's not necessarily why they're there.

-Dual Wielding.

-An all new perk system never before seen in an Elder Scrolls game.

-Combat tweaks, most noticed in finishing moves and active shield/weapon bashing.

-The Radiant AI system, which is designed by nature to be unnoticeable on any individual playthrough.

-Modified racial abilities/skill bonuses for all races.


All that is just off the top of my head. Really, there's plenty of new stuff...you either aren't noticing it, are willfully ignoring it, or are unsatisfied by it. Which of the three is it, and if it's the last one, what would you want to see?

@gabriel77dan All that is improved accept NPCS
Kill someone in Banner mare while sneaking. Npc will just stand up, go near the body any say : "What an shame" Or something like that and they will return to their "jobs" like nothing happend
See how uncomplete is it?
They could make this scenario : Everyone runs outside and call the guards,they investigate and remove the body, later in whole town NPC would talk about killer in Whiterun and discuss about that, or killing a dragon makes city call you a town hero and giving you free drinks and place to stay..
NPCs everyday say the same thing to each other, 1 dialog for each NPC to NPC conversations, that rly annoying

But as I was saying there is a lot of unfinished stuff and I dont get reason for not finish it, and around 500 bugs is way to much

Regardless what they said in the press, I see consistent improvement in: dialogue and voice acting, world design, storytelling, combat. The unpleasant surprise is that the AI is still very very incredibly weak (pathfinding, unaware of what is happening around) and that the guilds quest lines are unbelievably short and underwhelming.

What version of Oblivion were YOU playing? Modded maybe, but in vanilla the guards were psychic to the point they could spot you killing an NPC a thousand feet away.

The unfortunate truth is (at least in my experience) that NPC AI in most games these days is not emphasized by game developers. Skyrim is a mediocre improvement over Oblivion's AI; whether or not that's enough to satisfy you is something only you can say, but I certainly won't argue that it couldn't be better.

Myself, the mediocre AI is something I've grown used to in an Edler Scrolls game. I don't love it and certainly wouldn't mind seeing an improvement, but I can live with it just fine.

No, I see that as demanding a feature that is almost beyond realistic capacity and most community expectations. The NPCs provide plenty of fresh dialogue around quest objectives, even minor ones. But you somehow want the NPCs to respond to your every little action, do you know how many actions you can do in this game? and to top that off how many variations upon those actions there are?

We all want advancement but get real.

A,B and C.Why?
Maybe beacuse they add it just to make them new features and not actually putting big effort in making them complete and balanced or are too small to be noticted and can dont take effort to make.
You can totaly abuse crafting system [Smithing]
Dual Wielding is a new feature and this one is what u can actually call a feature and improvment but u cant even store staff , it just appears/disappears from you, only thing u can actually store is Bow and arrows and Dual handed weapon beacuse one of your weapons when using 2 one handed weapons disappears
I hope u understood what I ment with store.
Finishing moves are not that hard to "invent" and I dont think that it took them actually hard work to do it.Same for racial abillities/skills

Again, my point, its a great game but its unfinished from unknown reasons, or should I say not detailed


Gotta go more discuss later =DD

Well honestly, I killed some bum in Windhelm, and everytime I go there guards and citizens go "Oh, what happened here?"
And uh... I want that body removed.
I realize that they can't react to "every" action we perform, but I'd at least thought that they design NPC's as to.. Yknow, React to a dead body a little more...
I mean, NPC's react to if you are naked, if you are using a spell, if you are in light, heavy or faction armor, if you are a werewolf.
But Bethesda never thought about making NPC's react more to a dead body?
Or at least make it disappear after a while?

I think that Skyrim has made a lot of improvments but I gotta say I'm a little disappointed in this as well.
Cause I mean every single time I go to Windhelm they comment on the body, and I'm far too lazy to drag it away to somewhere people never look, and I shouldn't have to.
At least make the body disappear after 10 days or something yknow.
But NPC's should react a little more to it as well, make guards unsheat their weapons and walk around for a minute or two at the very least.

The difference is polish. Skyrim feels like a much more solid, cohesive, non-fluorescent-potato-looking-head-people game than Oblivion did.