Before I begin, I'd like to say that no, allowing some form of blocking or parrying while dual-wielding or wielding a spell and a weapon would not make shields useless. A shield is inherently a better tool for blocking/deflecting attacks simply by its design and its size (that allows the blocking of projectiles and some elemental attacks). This "balance" nonsense is just that... nonsense. There are infinitely better ways to balance two styles in relation to one another than by removing one of the actual advantages of dual-wielding (fluid wielding capabilities... which, leaving the character seemingly a moron incapable of making the connection between metal stick and deflecting another metal stick, and removing the fun out of a system (What's fun about simply spamming attacks until the enemy is dead?). Plus, increased rates of damage with dual-wielding make little sense, to me, because you don't constantly swing both weapons at the same time.

Anyway, I've always loved swords and the romanticized concept of them portrayed in fantasy and as a result, I've always played my sword and magic fantasy games with a sword. It's always been something I love. You see a movie with people sword-fighting in it and they're trading blows and parrying them with their sword or blocking them with a shield and I just love the conflict as well as the regal, ornate look of a sword that I attribute to the sword being a more civil and specialized weapon. What the sword symbolizes, to me, cannot be matched by any other weapon, so it's only natural that I gravitate towards a love of swords and a use of swords whenever possible. Now, in all four games of the series that I have played (Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, and Oblivion), this type of dual-wielding where two weapons can be used at one time (as opposed to simply switching them in Daggerfall) was never an option. At first, I was a bit skeptical of the thought, but since it was announced to be in Skyrim, it's grown on me. I love swords and dual-wielding brings more of the parrying... more of that conflict I love, into a game. Then, the possibility of dual-wielding not having blocking, or rather parrying, as a part of it came up as a rumor... partially fueled by the fact that sword and spell combos were confirmed as not allowing blocking/parrying. When it was finally confirmed, I was torn. Here is the new feature, this new great feature that promised to appeal to a sword-lover on a whole new level and was hyped-up so early on that is now confirmed to be nothing but button-spamming. Arena, Daggerfall, and Morrowind never had manual blocking... just spamming, and I can say that was just horrid.

With all the improvements Bethesda has made and strives to make with their combat, I'm stunned that they decided on such a decision... and I'm even more upset that people resort to constantly defending this action on the matter of "balance" so readily with little true anolysis of what they're saying or how the system will now play out as a result. As I said, balance can be achieved in many ways... some even inherent to the true nature of dual-wielding. This is pathetic and has just crushed my hopes for Skyrim's combat. It's not a shooter. Swords are practically meant for parrying. Before someone brings it up, no, this is not a console controller limitation. I don't know what they put in the place of the two attack button combination, but I'd rather take my swords crossing together or some parry capability in it's place. They could assign a parry or block function to that button combination. They could also do the same for the sword and spell combination. They have enough space to do it with sword and shield combinations while also having that bash. They can do the same thing for dual-wielding or wielding a spell and a weapon at the same time.

I think you CAN parry if you time it right. I think I saw it in an E3 video.

To me, I guess it's a bummer, but I honestly probably only blocked a total o 30 minutes in my 800+ hours of Oblivion

If you bash with your weapon as the opponent is the act of attacking it staggers them. Isn't 100% confirmed, but that's a what a shield bash does, and a weapon bash was shown in the E3 footage, so it seems likely.

First off, you cannot "block" with a sword. The intention and use of a shield is to absorb a blow so that the shock is sent throughout the shield, and not your arm. You can only "parry" with a sword, not "block" with it. That's real life, by the way.

Secondly, I agree. I think being able to parry is something we should have the option to do, especially whilst dual-wielding.

Yeah, watched it again and say staggering effect while enemy was attacking and an attack made with the hilt of a sword.

I feel your pain....


I'd be content with a simple cross blades block when you hold both triggers
Let's hope they decide to add it. It's not too late.

They've said that holding both trigger at the same time causes you to attack with both weapons at the same time.

I think they are trying to stop blocking being so important. In Oblivion, even if you didn't take block as a major skill, you would end up using it if you used a melee weapon because the combat revolved around it's use. With this bashing thing (that isn't tied to a skill) it gives people who do not want to focus on block an option to parry instead.

Besides blocking is the act of taking the brunt of the damage. This makes sense with a shield, it is it's purpose. It's possible with a two-hander because of it's weight. It's possible with a single handed-weapon because you can grip it with both hands and brace yourself. If you tried it with two one-handed weapons it's likely going to smash straight through, hence why you parry instead, you use force, to knock away an oncoming force.

I feel the same way, i'd just love it if you could simply block by holding both triggers on xbox :/

if thats true that seems kind of silly. most of the force you get when striking something or someone comes from rotating your torso. just try and stand up and swing as hard as you can only using your arm and then do the same thing like you normally would. you will noticed that alot of the force comes from your legs and torso. now if you do the same thing swinging with just both arms and swining both arms like you would normally do it you will notice that whichever way your turning the off arm is going to have significanly less force behind it.

frankly they should replace the dual attack with some sort of dual parrying instead.

Yeah. I wanted to play a staff & sword sort of character, but I don't think I'll be able to if I can't prevent myself from getting hit effectively. From what I know so far, it’s pretty much forcing me to use a sword and shield, which I hate doing. Even in oblivion, I normally fought with a single sword. :confused:

You can still block with a single sword (nothing else in other hand). If you were using a staff and sword then you could get used to the timing of the bash to stagger enemies then blast/slash them when they are open.

I know that first part. It's why I put the blocking in my title in parenthesis... but to the average Elder Scrolls fan, parrying is all blocking and factions are all guilds.

Naw, I've never been one for timing (comedic or otherwise). But I've got this figured out. I'll just Fusrodah people right before they take a swing at me, and then blast the crap out of them with said staff while they fly (likely ungracefully) through the air.

Blocking while dual weilding doesn't even have to be very effective in my opinion - but I want to be able to do it, because it's a lot more fun to be able to block in a fight, no matter if it is very effective or not.

Oh, ok. Good.
Most forum goers, as you said, just think that blocking with a sword is possible and they say it not realizing that's not possible lol.
But yeah, again, being able to parry with a sword is crucial to up close gameplay, I mean, you can't just sit there and not be able to defend yourself at all while attacking. That's suicide. And it's not like parrying is some sort of "oh sh*t!" button, parrying only partially deflects a blow, not fully. You're still taking the majority of the damage, just not all of it. Blocking absorbs most of the damage, and you take partial.

The reasoning behind them excluding this feature is beyond me.

Another solution is to favourite sword and staff and just the sword right next each other. Use the sword to block an attack, then when you need to quickly switch to staff/sword to attack, switch back to defend and so. Not a great solution, but I imagine once you get used to it you'll be able to switch back and forth easily without disrupting the game flow too much.

Well, they could be "realistic" about it and let you attempt to block... and have your arm break and/or the enemy's weapon plunge straight into you with possibly your own, as well. It'd make for some interesting death videos on Youtube.

Oh, and I agree. It doesn't need to be all that effective, but the flow of gameplay is simply too boring and monotonous if all you can do is keep swinging, in my opinion.

Im actually looking forward to it, i think it'll be a challenge but i agree there should be some sort of defensive manouvre. Im away to go check out this sword bash thing in the e3 demo ^_^

Happens during the draugr fight bit :thumbsup:

What happens? It's been confirmed that you cannot parry while dual wielding.

So this "sword bash" seems to be our only hope at the moment. I wonder how this will be implemented? Through a perk? Maybe the shield bash perk under block simply works with weapons too... What do you guys think? There's also a "riposte" perk there, but that's probably some kind of counter attack.

It's been confirmed you cannot block while dual wielding. As in hold the weapons in a blocking stance to deflect blows using the block skill. Doesn't stop you bashing them with the pommel in the face when they are about to hit you to knock them backwards =]

In the footage a druagr is about to hit the player and he strikes it (actually unsure it that was a bash, or a mis-timed bash) and the dragur get's knocked backwards. What follows is what is interesting, the player then lashes out striking the draugr with the pommel of the blade, which is what I think he meant to do on the first hit.

I can understand not being able to block with a spell since my hand isn't really designed to stop incoming blows but I am surprised that you can't parry while duel weilding something like swords, I can kinda see from a balance perspective that duel weilding gives you a huge attacking advantage that someone using a sword and shield lacks but they get to block and thus negate some damage, I imagine they probably attempted to allow duel weilding parry's but they were probably incredibly weak as to balance duel weilding and a sword and shield that it wasn't really worth doing. They also seem to be trying to get away fron the oblivion formula of constantly blocking with only the occasional blow hence the timeing of blows and things like shield bashing.

Is it confirmed to not be in? I thought that was just a rumour.

Yeah that's the thing, Todd said they wanted the combat to be more about timing. This is why when using a shield, if you hold it up for too long you lash out with it instead. In Oblivion you would hide behind the shield, wait for an attack, let it bounce off, then follow up with some attacks, put the shield (or weapon) back up, then repeat. It also means people can use melee weapons without having to rely on the block skill all the time.