It just seemed like a bit of a shame that radiant AI wasn't incorporated into Oblivion, and if they could modify it so the NPC's don't kill each other of brooms and things, then it would be pretty cool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjbx6-KQoRg.

Having Radiant AI would just be amazing, just modify it abit and it will be succesful !

RAI was in Oblivion, it was just scaled down and mostly concerned with NPC scheduling.

I'd love it if they managed to work out the problems they encountered with RAI, or otherwise found a way to advance the system in some other way.

No thanks, save system resources for something more relevant. I'd rather they spend some time improving the combat and dialogue systems instead.

Eh, I have to disagree Darth. Combat works just fine, save a few points that wouldn't take very long to bang out, and dialogue should be regressed to what it was in Morrowind, but still combined with voice acting in places. Particulalry, if we assume RAI is in, when NPC's meet each other. I'd rather see a lot of voiced dialogue there than in PC/NPC convos.

Assuming they were already far enough with radiant AI to include it in the E3 demo of oblivion, I do expect it in Skyrim. At the very least we should see some less robotic conversations.

'Radiant AI' is just what they called their AI, and that's what we got. It was never going to be as detailed as with that women and her dog in the E3 demo.

It makes sense that they're going forwards and not backwards with their AI, so yeah, scheduled AI will be back. Probably somewhat better. But nothing like that demo.

What are you guys talking about? Radiant AI was developed FOR Oblivion to improve the overly simplistic behavior of NPCs in Morrowind. Oblivion INTRODUCED Radiant AI. It couldn't have been "scaled back" or have been "[un]incorporated" considering it was the first game to use it...

It can also be the result of simple scripting.

But it didn't actually use it.
In essence, Radiant AI was an effort to get the NPC's to do tasks without scripts telling them HOW to do them each time.
The problem came when they told one NPC to do a task (aka sweep) and another NPC to stand around, but the standing around NPC had the broom.
The sweeper would then proceed to kill the standing around NPC so they could get on with their job.
Or I think that was the problem :unsure2:

There at the beginning, the dark elf seemed to simply watch what was going on before that dude talked to him. I think it wuld be great if the dark elf would have leaned to wards the stone wall, simply relaxing. Then that other dude could have got beside him, he too leaning towards the stone wall and exchange words with each other, without having to be so formal. But that crazy paralyze and fireball at the end, I was like fuu! Lovely dog gets toasted for nothing, he just wanted to play? If they could fix that, then it would be awesome.

I hope its improved. Hopefully priotising different items would make sense. For example eating someone elses would result in lowered dispostion and a good talking to. While weapons and jewelary would result in violence.

It doesn't. I guess you're just a lot more easy to please than I am. The special attacks are horribly implemented. The damage is too low at higher levels, making enchanting weapons pretty much a must (unless you like clicking and drinking potions for 5 minutes in every encounter). Even if the special attacks were implemented well, there are very few of them, they're all the same for every weapon and their random nature makes them impossible to add to a genuine tactical plan. You're usually better off with a high damage enchantment dagger swinging as fast as possible. At the very least they should toss in more variety in terms of moves. Bows are even worse off, because they don't do nearly enough damage at high levels to justify their slow loading, and the jerky graphics engine and fast enemies makes good aiming virtually impossible for people like me who can't usually aim all that well to begin with.

1. Damage problems: That's to do with bad leveling not the combat itself.
2. Lack of tactics: Fair enough.
3. Bows: It's true that the way that the arrows curve could use a little work. Though it's pretty easy to get the hang of if you just keep practicing, like your character would.
:ninja:

That's more to do with level scaling than it does actual combat mechanics. The special attacks and the aiming issue with bows (though I never had a problem with them, even if I wasn't sneaking) are a given, yes, but things that, as I said, they are things that can be easily banged out without devoting a lot of resources.

gah ninja'd by soul

That was the official excuse, yeah, because the AI in the game itself was nothing like what they were boasting about in the interviews. Honestly if NPCs killing each other was an issue there would've been ways around that. I don't buy it.

That is one hell of a glitch. Perhaps if they were to program them to understand the approximate value of a life?

It's been many years since they decided to scale back the RAI. I'd very surprised if they haven't found a way to make people sweep at a whim, without rioting over a broom, by now.

That would be awesome. "GIVE ME THE BROOM"

Bad leveling affects the combat itself.




I'm not talking about the way the arrows curve. I'm talking about enemy random jerky movements making it difficult to hit anything without luck. I'm not a great shot by any stretch of imagination but I did not have this problem in morrowind. In Oblivion, bow combat feels a bit like fighting agents from the matrix.

Of course it does, but thats an entirely separate issue from actual combat mechanics needing to be changed, such as your issue with bow fighting. Don't blame the combat mechanics for crappy damage when its the poor leveling system thats doing it.




In Morrowind, most enemy tactics amounted to running directly at you or running backwards to fire another bow or spell. Though in Oblivion they may have overdone it (or just plain implemented it wrong), what occurs in Oblivion is an improvement to the combat. And indeed, a lot of what I've witnessed in this regard is more just crappy path finding than anything else. Again, it affects combat, but it isn't combat mechanics thats doing it.

Now, if you want to be fighting Agents, then you should install Deadly Reflex. Its hard to hit your target unless they don't know that you're shooting at you because they dodge every arrow.

My turn to be ninja'd :ninja:

You mean making important npcs essential? Yeah, they did that. However having all the npcs in the game essential wouldn't be a solution, so that didn't work. You can see what happens even with the scaled down AI with City Swimmer, or when the "sleeper agents" transform and attack you later in the game. Fights start, in one case for me involving most of the Market area in the IC and leaving a lot of bodies behind, including a few shopkeepers. Only guards named "guard" respawn, so I ended up reloading. With the "not turned down" AI, they found scheduling everyone for lunch at one time was an equally bad idea; once the food was gone from one tavern everyone left to find food somewhere else. Or they tried to pickpocket, which caused other problems when guards intervened. There was one quest with skooma dealers where they never found the npc they needed alive, because they were killed for their stash. Part of the problem is that the game still goes on, even when the player isn't present; may not happen as fast as it would with the player present, but "life" goes on, the npcs like City Swimmer do their thing, and the guards do their thing, and you find dead npcs around. Of course, you can also use this to your advantage; the one DB guy for me is always killed by the guards, the beggar, and usually a Mage or two. Once he shoots at my pc and hits a guard, everyone joins in while I go up out of the way and watch.

There was a compilation of developer quotes on one site; one of the devs explained the problems they were having with it.

Could anyone link it? I'd love to read it

It must've been hilarious (and frustrating) to be an AI developer for Oblivion. I do hope they found ways around all these problems after Oblivion shipped, because the complete radiant AI that was planned for Oblivion sounds awesome. For example, guards threatening to arrest people to stop fights instead of just murdering everyone would be nice. Or NPC's refraining from stealing and picking locks unless they're thieves.