I just want the option to:

A:] Join the Enclave.
B:] Reform it or make it hardline.
C:] help make it great again.

My big hope is that we never hear the words "Modified FEV virus" again, however.

Styles this is wiki for you............ says if Barneky is the donor the calculator will start a genocide on all "unpure" humans. even has the quotes.

That is basically Enclaves mo. The calculator would have killed mid west bos if they are not pure. Then when Enclave got to Chcago they would find a powerful calculator that really likes pure humans.

We can be pretty certain that there are some Enclave there.

I thought bos was pure because of power armour and being in bunkers. Those first guys at west tek didn t get radiation because of pa I thought.

Any competent leader given the option to make a deal for peace or die would go with make a deal for peace. Brotherhood have the remnants that are only a few hundred if that give or take a dozen or so. Brotherood greatly out number them. Why doesn't the brotherhood simply kill them? Simple: Mexican Standoff. Brotherhood can kill them but the Enclave can still give them a very bloody nose. Plus the BoS want the tech and the people that understand it. Saves them years of reverse engineering.

Can the Enclave fall for such a trap? Yes. MWBoS have been in Chicago are for several decades. Under my theory they have been fighting a guerilla war for decades. They should know Chicago like the back of their hand. Greatly out numbering remnants, they could easly surround them.



I agree that the Enclave died on the Rig (Enclave). I don't want the Enclave back as a super power but we both know people will always ask for them back. Bethesda might cave to the pressure and bring them back yet again from the dead. I don't want that. Now I do want the Midwestern BoS back and I want them back as more then some pathedic group in a hole somewhere in Chicago. Way I see it this is a win win. Enclave fans get Enclave tech and weapons (really most new fans only love them for the toys) and Midwestern Fans get MWBoS back.

Fallout over all gets a darker Brotherood.

I hate when it does that.

You going to respond on "Bethesda Justing Throwing BoS Everywhere" topic?

Why do you have something for me???

Barnaky and Enclave have a different view of what is a pure human. Enclave base it on DNA and Barnaky on "you have 10 fingers and 10 toes," You look human you are human.

Calculator is not in Chicago its in Colorado. Still the Midwestern Brotherhood were able to make it from Chicago area to Colorado. Only something happened to caused them never to make contact with the Original knowledge hoarding BoS. That something could very well be that they start a http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2ZcpcO7C58 of ghouls, super mutants, other mutations and humans that side with them. Causing a huge backlash and people no longer want to join them. People rebel against them and Barnaky starts killing Brotherhood members. A Mutant Liberation Army is formed.

Yeah.

I can t talk about fo2 anymore till I play it.

I just would think a dev would know.

I said you were right about 92.

There is too much conflicting info out there on the story behind the story. I don t like it.

Avellones writings are the best we have of the story behind the story. He knew someone else might get the game when he answered all those questions. Revised it 9 times........ He had to have been serious about it. Its meant to be some answers. Story behind the story stuff, ground rules.

I ll argue no more about context that may involve fo2 till I play it. I need a better feel for it. I sometimes think that people may get Enclave and U.S. government and think they were the same. If Enclave was a shadow goverment with in the U.S. govn. How could they run the show on a 645 billion dollar vault project all for themselves?

They weren't, they were a shadow government above the US government but happened to have people from within the Government on their side; some of their members within the government pass it past whomever and given that the experiments happened it's clear that they had people in Vault-Tec.

My theory on how it ran was this:

The Enclave: Probably didn't have any real name at this point but was an "Old Boy's Network" of businessmen and politicians who gained enough influence to be able to make decisions on a massive level and cover up their crimes. It probably had the ability to select who would be the President of the United States, who the USA would go to war with, and potentially fake elections. It also undoubtedly had many corporate leaders in its ranks.

I

The actual US government: Which was filled with Hawks being manipulated by the Enclave to do whatever they wanted.

I

Vault-Tec: Vault-Tec was just a corporation which might have people in the Enclave in its upper ranks but isn't CONTROLLED by the Enclave. I always had the amusing theory that the Enclave shot themselves in the foot by employing Vault-Tec because it was obviously a scam from the very beginning. If they're the guys behind the "porta-shelters" in the Capital Wasteland then they had to be milking people for all they were worth.

I

RoboCo: Mister House may or may not have been a member of the Enclave. Let's face it, Mister House was clearly very influential (the portrait indicates he may have created Liberty Prime) and was responsible for many Enclave technologies (Arcade says RepConn did some business with the Enclave - and Mister House owned RepConn). It's possible he ultimately chose to stay in Las Vegas than join the guys on the Oil Rig.

Yeah, we are perfectly in agreement, the Enclave was not an official organisation -an Old Boys Club, I like that - on how the show was run; except about Vault-Tec. The Vaults were in some cases designed, from the gound up, to habour the experiments; like Vault 11, that chamber beneath the Overseer's Office and Vault 19 with the colour co-ordinated dormetries. Vault-Tec wasn't behind the Portable Shelters that was Polawsky Preservation Societies or something like that and was set-up to deliberately milk all of those who couldn't afford Vault places.

No they shouldn't have been in f3 either but no theey somehow go from a few soldiers and a few scientist to a army in f3 I don't wanna see them bigger then a few remenants unless in chiago with 25 soldiers and you can't join them

Avellone says in that quote that Richardson does know about them. Its just really weird that they would be able to control the experiments from the get go. The U.S. Military would want in on that.

Its just another attack on fo3 ruining the fo series. I m just trying to find holes so Military experiments go with the flow. If Richardson knows every single thing about every single vault, then fo3 is wrong, but if Richardson just has an overall general knowledge about the vaults like Avellone pointed to, then there is room for fo3 to fit.

I just try to defend fo3 from the "ruined the series" people.

Charlmagne your therory of fo pre war Enclave is so good it almost sounds real........... oh wait..........

Look, I don't care about F3, this isn't about that. Oh and another quote from Doctor Henry in Fallout 2:

{111}{}{The Chosen One? Of course, that makes sense. Interesting... I'm afraid I can't help you. I was assigned to cyber-genetics research, not the Vault Behavioral Project.}
{113}{}{Vault Behavioral project?}
117}{}{Something about extreme sociological conditioning. Mind you, I thought it was all so much mumbo-jumbo, no real science in it at all. But I did hear something about 13 having to be improvised during the course of the experiment. Sloppy work, I'd say.}

The Enclave created the Vault Experiments and continued to moniter them after the bombs fell. Vault 87 & 92 are not social experiments which is what the Vaults were created to be.

And I don t care about the Enclave, but if they knew everysingle thing about everysingle vault and there is no possible way the military could use some, then fo3 is wrong.

That is why I got that quote out. There are alot of things that say some vault tech records were lost in the war as well. There may or may not be 122 vaults, there may or may not have been a few of those vaults for U.S. military experiments added in.

I look for the holes left by the writers so things could change if they wanted them to. I found a few, so with those holes I can say fo3 was right in what they did with 87 and 92.

I just try to defend the honor of the great fo3

the words "something about" and "mumbo-jumbo" leaves doubt that this man knew everything about the vaults. He knows what he heard or read is what this tells me. He has a general idea of what they are about, but he couldn t tell you about vault tec records lost during the war. If you could go back and drill this guy on everything vault related from the jump he couldn t tell you.

Your right he didn't, that's why he says that he was in Cybernetics and not the VAULT BEHAVIOURAL PROJECT. He only knew about the Vaults what the scientist who worked on the Vaults told him.

Can you talk to those scientists in fo2?

It's Doctor Henry, the guy from Fallout: New Vegas, he's in the NCR.

Sadley I can t ask him questions about the topic.

I think that you might need a good charisma or speech because there are options where he realises that he is talking about the Enclave and he shuts up.

Enclave knew about the Vaults experiments because they were the ones that came up with them. So yes Fallout 3 is wrong when it comes to Vault 87... Unless you factor in people in the military that are members of the Enclave and the Enclave were intrested in studying another type of FEV. So they had one of the Vaults made for such research. Not that great of an explanation but it kinda works :shrug:

I think they should.

I dont know why people are so quick to assume that there dead. THERE ARE OTHER LOCATIONS WHERE THEY COULD HAVE GONE. We only covered a portion of America. There are other locations i have you know.