want that.

gonna be a freakin' pro expert capacity in ....stuff

:-)))

Lol, I'd rather they just made it based on your charisma level and left it at that. No building it up needed. Either you have the charisma check to haggle or you don't.

How is it dumbing down? Having a silver tongue just means you are good at speaking whether it is speaking to a trader or to an ordinary waste lander.

The current system and the way it does it is incredibly dumb in itself

Anyway this seems a moot point since it seems skills as they were are gone likely replaced by a S.P.E.C.I.A.L + perk hybrid

To be fair if they didn't do that in Skyrim speech would have been absolutely useless. I can't think of a single situation in which I talked myself into or out of anything in the game...

But to be fair, they should not been so incompetent in making speech a useless skill in the first place.

As for the skills to be combined, I believe they should not. Having the proper rational to convince someone of his wrong doing is not the same as someone experienced in mercantile and the trade. To have more skills available can allow much more variety with the player character.

skills do not exist anymore, so it matters little anyway.

It will matter when there is only one perk called "DA SPEECHEZ" that just benefits talking without taking into consideration the different ways there can be when dealing with NPCs through dialogue.

you forgot the options Of Do I looke like i Give a damn? Just ship the game already!

and

Tacos!

nope, will not matter to Bethesda, people will still buy the game, most will actually.

companies rarely, if ever, actually take forums idea's into consideration or what is screamed around in the forums. especially with a game that is FINSIHED pretty much. you can complain all you want, but it is never going to be heard.

I'd rather they didn't combine them, but I'm not going to lose sleep over it if they do.

No, they shouldn't merge the two skills (if they exist at all...)

Looking at it from that perspective, obviously it won't matter. Won't make it any less of a lacking system that has lost some depth as a RPG, which will matter to those who seek such in a game. Regardless, we know very little as to how the system will work for the game, so I won't jump to any conclusions just yet.

Yes, you bet I will.

But I also bought C&C4 no matter what, because it is the "finale" of the series that got me into gaming.

Now take a guess which company hasn't got a single cent from me since?

People will buy the game because Bethesda managed to build a certain trust that they make games that we will enjoy.

Although usually a bit buggy, they (the games) are usually huge enough that you can work around the bugs and, more importantly, they fix them.

But trust is far easier to destroy than build (like most things).

And if they are smart they will keep earning their money the "honest" way.

Listening to their customers wishes and needs and catering to them. Earning a good reputation which will lead to better sales.

If the quality and quantity of content is sufficient they could even slap on a higher price without too much complaints, since they DID put in extra effort that has to be paid.

Sounds like a mutually beneficient relationship between customer and developer to me.

The other way is EA, and I don't think I have to explain a lot about that.

There is no barter or speech skill anymore. I think the question should be, does the traits of speech also apply to barter? Can a sweet talker (speech) use his ability to haggle prices? In a way he can, so there is relation. But, a person who is good with speech wouldn't be the best at barter because somebody who is good at barter knows the economy and price flux. I think there was a video somebody linked in another thread about the possible layout of the perk system which would have perks boost your traits either individually or across several traits. Lets say the Sociable perk would increase barter and speech, but the Wall Street Tycoon perk would only benefit barter. If you had both perks, you would be well versed in bartering/economic affairs and decent at speech related things. I think under this view that barter and speech shouldn't be split up because there is a slight disconnect when viewing these skills to a point where they couldn't be one.

My guess with the new skill system, we'll get a few Barter-related perks under Charisma, including a ranked perk that affects prices like the original Barter skill. Charisma itself will also govern barter prices, which we already know is happening.

Barter should be subordinate to a more general speech skill; it's different enough to be distinguished from speech in general, but the games have never justified it having equal standing in the skill system as speech. Same goes for almost all the more distinct skills; give them perks so that we can still distinguish between a hacker and an engineer, or a medic and a chemist, etc, but don't turn them into full-fledged skills unless there's enough gameplay to support investing in one skill over another.

no, you don't, because EA is still, by far the biggest gaming companies of all time. Everyone yells about how horrible they are, yet people still buy their games.

I believe I've watched the same video you're preferring to (I believe it was from Gopher), where as he made examples that there were a variety of perks available for using guns, which would allow a lot of differentiation for characters. Like a perk that allows you to be good with pistols, but another perk called gunslinger that makes you even better with revolvers and lever-action weaponry. I admit it was a system that intrigued me but I wasn't sure about it. It certainly had some level of variety to it.

I'm down with combining the two.

Barter is one of those annoying skills in RPGs that just feels like a dead end in most cases.

No.

Just more dumbing down when you merge and cut.

link or are you just assuming ?

link?

Ever been to a pawn shop?

No more merging. There's been too much of that already (and now even on a larger scale with the assimilation perks and skills - if that indeed is the case like it seems).

E3 video(s),There is no sign if skill requirements ANYWHERE in any of the videos, not in the crafting, power armor, or any other menu or screen, instead we simply see names of what are probably perks of some description, and even then, only sometimes.

I'd prefer it if they were separate.

I have a lot of reasons for this, many of which have already been mentioned, but if anything for roleplay reasons.

Maybe I want my character to be a traveling merchant who builds trade hubs with the shelter building mechanic and runs a tightly knit wasteland economy.

Maybe I want my character to be a charismatic leader who builds a collection of settlements builtnfor survival and acts as a Shepard in these dark time post apocalyptic times.

One being barter, one being speech.