Your getting too much Earth in my Nirn : V - Skyrim

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:43 am

Sorry about the confusing failure of a post up above, folks. I'm posting from a phone and can't edit my posts. And apparently, can't quote properly either.

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:03 pm

It's a matter of low-fantasy vs. high fantasy. Morrowind was high fantasy, which was a lot of fun, Oblivion was low-fantasy, which was again fun, however they were both lacking something. They were lacking a piece of the other. Skyrim seems to have hit things right down the middle, not too high and not too low.

I always imagined Cyrodiil to be more mid-fantasy.

Sorry about the confusing failure of a post up above, folks. I'm posting from a phone and can't edit my posts. And apparently, can't quote properly either.

Good luck. (unless of course you disagree with me

)

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:43 pm

No, it wasn't. Mankar's http://www.imperial-library.info/content/oblivion-mythic-dawn-commentaries refer to it as having been a jungle, and it was changed to a forest by Talos.

http://www.imperial-library.info/content/pocket-guide-empire-first-edition-cyrodiil and the http://www.imperial-library.info/content/oblivion-song-pelinal also call it a jungle.

It wasn't a jungle in Arena, either. It was retconned into one.

Cyrodiil was a jungle prior to the third era. After the third era, it was Temperate Rainforest, except Colovia.

And it's not High Fantasy (Lord of the Rings) vs. Low Fantasy (Conan the Barbarian) ... it's "Alien" (Morrowind) vs "Familiar"(Daggerfall, Arena, and Oblivion)

I wish people would stop thinking Morrowind is the epitome of The Elder Scrolls... Even if it is the "Best" game, "Daggerfall" is still truest in spirit to The Elder Scrolls.

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:06 pm

i dont know synok that mammoth looked pretty freakish skin like gnarled bark matted moss like hair and most of all 4 tusks. if you want high fantasy wait til elder scrolls argonia your sure to see some strange creatures like hackbeaks for instance huge ostrich sized birds with long thick serrated beaks they give you a good chop fly away and wait for you to bleed out then return to eat you. flesh eating swarms of flies. swamp titans. huge slime monsters. it will be quite a journey...if you survive

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:50 am

i just saw a dragon fly by my window

oh wait its attacking a gient... is that an undead? oh hey look is an oger

crap i was robbed by a Wood elf

found my stuff next to a gient spider... oh crap.... RUUUUUUUUNUNNNNNNN!!!!

Oh, I just found this fantasy book where a giant is fighting a dragon!

Oh, is this a story about a group of trolls attacking a village?

That elf is a real bastard!

That's not the point of the thread.
Giants, undeads, ogres, trolls and giant spiders are all generic fantasy stuff. That's what he meant with "too much Earth in my Nirn".

Is it too hard to read between the lines instead of starting a silly assault-thing believing to demoralize the OP with it?

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 11:00 am

I think they're just trying to get the Countries to fit the race that lives there. i.e The Impereeaels, and Nords are human, so their countries are more like Earth. But Morrowind, land of the Dark Elves would obviously be more fantastical. Don't worry, they have to run out of human races eventually

. I'm personally hoping for the next game to be set in Elswyer!

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 10:03 am

I think they're just trying to get the Countries to fit the race that lives there. i.e The Impereeaels, and Nords are human, so their countries are more like Earth. But Morrowind, land of the Dark Elves would obviously be more fantastical. Don't worry, they have to run out of human races eventually

. I'm personally hoping for the next game to be set in Elswyer!

You're not the only one. In Elsweyr, we'd finally be able to enjoy a proper jungle!

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 3:54 am

Cyrodiil was a jungle prior to the third era. After the third era, it was Temperate Rainforest, except Colovia.

And it's not High Fantasy (Lord of the Rings) vs. Low Fantasy (Conan the Barbarian) ... it's "Alien" (Morrowind) vs "Familiar"(Daggerfall, Arena, and Oblivion)

I wish people would stop thinking Morrowind is the epitome of The Elder Scrolls... Even if it is the "Best" game, "Daggerfall" is still truest in spirit to The Elder Scrolls.

We don't want "Alien". We want "Uniqueness".

Give us something that we haven't seen a million times before (Goblins, Ogres, Temperate forests...). Make the game similar to a part of Earth if you like, but make it interesting and unique to RPG's. Something we've not seen before.

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:55 pm

For the most part, if Bethesda follows the Pocket Guides (except for the propaganda) and the rest of Skyrim lore, while filling in the gaps, Skyrim should be good.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 12:59 am

Morrowind is the odd one out. All elder scrolls games before TES III were earth like. I want TES to be like TES. Not TES be like Morrowind. If there is another game set in Morrowind or one set in Black Marsh then there should be less earth.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 9:58 am

It's hard to deny the quality of Skyrim's art direction and the feel that the world has(even from such a short demo). Honestly(for non-hostile creatures) it's essential that you immediately relate to them as such or the feeling that they are supposed to create would be missed. I don't believe you could get that "this place is alive with wildlife and I'm in it" feeling if all of the passive wildlife was strange and unusual. Putting wildlife that you recognize immediately will help a great deal in bringing you into the world and making you feel comfortable in it. That's how I see it anyway.

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:03 pm

I don't know what "uniqueness" and "alien" do people want from Skyrim of all places.
It's the first human province and it's mainly inspired by Norse mythology...

Most of the enemies I would expect are trolls, wolves, bears, maybe bigger, more magical versions of them, some yeti-like beings and maybe some ice-spirits...

I wouldn't call Rieklings and Falmer unique either, they're frost-goblins and frost-elves respectively, hardly the most original things you can think of...

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 10:14 am

I started TES with Morrowind and loved the unique world it sent me to filled with wonderous and dangerous creatures. Then Oblivion came out with it's focus on more traditional fantasy setting and it fit to have more Earth based creatures on it such as deer,bears, and horses. But when Skyrim was annouced I was hoping for less Earth based creatures and more unique animals to once again be the vast majority of animals. Unfortunatly, we are again getting too many generic animals running around (rabbits, foxes, deer, wolves, etc...) IMO, with little to zero unique qualities added to them to make them feel like they are from Nirn rather than Earth (even something as simple as the 4 tusks on the mammoths help). And that makes me a little concered that like Oblivion I will not feel like I'm living on a different world, but alternate version of Earth. Do you guys like the animals to based on real animals or would you prefer all/most of the creatures to be completely original? And for fun which creature would you like to see return most? I would love to see what Winged Twilights would look like in Skyrim.

This plus more unique hand placed items (unique model and texture [like Morrowind]) and I will be happy.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:45 am

Oh, I just found this fantasy book where a giant is fighting a dragon!

Oh, is this a story about a group of trolls attacking a village?

That elf is a real bastard!

That's not the point of the thread.
Giants, undeads, ogres, trolls and giant spiders are all generic fantasy stuff. That's what he meant with "too much Earth in my Nirn".

Is it too hard to read between the lines instead of starting a silly assault-thing believing to demoralize the OP with it?

who said i was Demoralizing i was just having fun with it

but anyway whether you look at it this way or not its far to much to ask for new never before seen creatures... there really is no such thing as generic when it comes to this stuff. it just depends on how they are portrayed.... you want to talk about reading between the lines then atleast know that a fantasy RPG there is no such thing as a generic creature... what would you want more all of the same or all of nothing... they put them in but they also determen there personality. what the op is saying is like calling the real world Generic... there are standerds that are in all fantasy rpg's and the devs own creatures. so please think before you say something in the fantasy rpg world is "too generic"

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:27 pm

I think Cyrodil being referred to as a jungle itself was a mistake and that it was temperate all along. The Imperials are heavily influenced by the Ancient Romans, and in the D&D campaign that nirn was ultimately based off it would make more sense for the Roman like empire to live in a temperate area. Whoever was doing the writing for Arena must of made a mistake.

What? In Arena, Cyrodiil itself was a temperate forest. I've walked around the Imperial City in Arena and it is definitely a temperate forest. Whoever wrote Redguard's Pocket Guide to the Empire made the mistake.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 4:59 am

Hopefully the alien will be included....yes, I attacked the first silt strider I saw :facepalm:

I agree that there could definitely be too much Earth...I like the fantastic in fantasy...and that's one of the reasons I'll hold off and decide if I'm buying this game :nod:

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:31 am

Edit: Never mind.

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:39 pm

It already looks like an improvement. I hope some Solstheim mobs make the leap over, rieklings and spriggans and whatnot.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 1:24 am

ok morrowind was set in the land of the dark elves oblivion was set in the land of human rule and when it comes to humans in fantasy. books movies and video games there not as magical as elves and barley care for nature skyrim is going to be set in a human ruled province so the same thing can be said.just wait untill we go back to an elf land or beast men land skyrim will probably be the last game set in a human province and the next game will probably be using a new generation console.skyrim should be the last game with humans in mind. so prepare for more exotic locations next time.

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:49 pm

Morrowind is actually the minority here. It turns out that the rest of nirn is actually very earth-like.

Todd said so himself.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:47 am

I started TES with Morrowind and loved the unique world it sent me to filled with wonderous and dangerous creatures. Then Oblivion came out with it's focus on more traditional fantasy setting and it fit to have more Earth based creatures on it such as deer,bears, and horses. But when Skyrim was annouced I was hoping for less Earth based creatures and more unique animals to once again be the vast majority of animals. Unfortunatly, we are again getting too many generic animals running around (rabbits, foxes, deer, wolves, etc...) IMO, with little to zero unique qualities added to them to make them feel like they are from Nirn rather than Earth (even something as simple as the 4 tusks on the mammoths help). And that makes me a little concered that like Oblivion I will not feel like I'm living on a different world, but alternate version of Earth. Do you guys like the animals to based on real animals or would you prefer all/most of the creatures to be completely original? And for fun which creature would you like to see return most? I would love to see what Winged Twilights would look like in Skyrim.

I like a mix. I LOVE Nirn being more earthlike. I like my in game home to feel like home, if you understand. It is like that familiartiy in Fairytales, where some faraway land where you have never been, nevertheless feels very cozy, very much like the very heart of home.

That said I LOVE phantasmagorical creatures and places. And that, for me, is what Oblivion is for. The Realms of Oblivion in all their shimmering, glistening, dreadful, wonderful, alternating, tantalizing, eroticizing, horrifying, mystifying glory and terror. I wabt to be able to visit more of the realms of Oblivion, even if its just pockets of them. See the wondrous Daedra and more of their races. And, when I have had enough, go back to my very Earth like county, in a tower on a forested Earthlike mountain, overlooking a very Earthlike river and village. Or, if it comforts you, you can pretend that rather than being Earthlike. . . Its like The Endor Moon! LOL

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:29 am

I, like a lot of other people on the forums felt like Oblivion was far too....perfect. Yes, there were bandits and violence and skooma dealers, but beyond that it felt like you were just taking a stroll through disney land.

I for one am glad they went that way. I've actually seen people complain about there being greenery and blue skies. In the era Oblivion was released it was "in" for the ridiculous "realistic equals depressing with most everything being dark gray and brown" trend of "realistic" graphics. I'm glad that bland "mature equals profanity and a dreary and corrupt atmosphere" style didn't infect the game.

Cyrodiil during Oblivion was the capitol province of a continental Empire. I think it makes perfect sense the rule of law has an orderly hold for the most part. It handled its mature themes with, well, maturity in my opinion, rather than yet another gray/brown dreary cookie cutter environment. Even the exaggerated bloom enhanced the game for me, making the world seem alive and very fantastic yet real looking at the same time.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 10:17 am

There are enough of both, mythological and normal creatures.
Besides Morrowind was the odd one out becose every other game from Arena to Oblivion was not so alien like. (Well Shivering isles was a bit alien)

» Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:45 pm

In all honesty, if I could create my own planet from scratch it would basically 'be' Skyrim so I'm pretty happy. Weird for the sake of weird isn't appealing to me. I prefer a grounded setting with fantastic elements rather than the other way around.

» Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:34 am

I think it's just regional. Provinces of Men are more earth-like and provinces of Mer and Beast races are more alien. Though I love to see Elder Scroll original creatures thrown in there to show that we're not entirely on Earth.